Squire's amplification history
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vincent_gallo
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I very much respect John Hall and am sure he knows best the history at the factory. Mark Arnquist may have been involved with the original repair of Chris’s broken headstock. Mark went into much detail with me regarding the matching of the color of Chris’s bass and in 1997 when I inspected the repair the color match was perfect and had been done long ago. Mark is a very honest guy so I think his side of the story may have at least some truth and that he did personally work on the bass. For the record, Mark Arnquist has done the best Rickenbacker repairs I have seen. (Andy Winter might agree with me). Since being very friendly with Chris Squire since 1997 I made it a point to see and feel the RM and listened to Chris tell stories about it often. I think the reason it found it’s way to the factory with the bridge pickup lead removed may have been because once the gauss disappeared the pickup sounded awful and noisy and someone must have removed the lead to get it out of the circuit until it got fixed. That is not fair evidence that Chris was not using the bridge pickup in the past. I agree with Mark Walker regarding the sound of Rickenbacker basses. I very much prefer the tone of the older pickups much more than the tone of the high gains. The 68 I got from Jeff was carefully restored to 100% original and is a very fine sounding bass today without those high gains. Remember , many of the best sounding Rickenbacker bass recordings were done playing 60’s basses.
Mark may well have been involved in the original repair, in which case Michael Tobias had to repair that break again. Grover and Michael are good friends and spoke on the phone about this instrument when it first arrived.
The main problem is that Michael is not particularly familiar with Rickenbacker instruments and in the course of repair, the truss rods slots had become completely filled with glue, rendering the rods useless. One would think that Mark wouldn't have made such a mistake, given his familiarity with our instruments.
Grover took the fence off one of the small jointer planers we had and planed the fingerboard off, stopping just at the glue line. He had been wondering why he couldn't remove the rods and found out when the slots were completely visible at this point about the glue.
The break had large voids visible from the interior of the neck and slight signs of cracking on the exterior. Grover carefully partially broke the head off again, after having made some kerf cuts lengthwise over the break, mostly under the fingerboard. He put new strips of Maple in the kerfs, planed again, then glued the whole thing back together. The rods slots were cleaned up with a chisel and a new fingerboard installed.
I honestly don't recall whether we refinished it then or not but I think Grover was able to do this with only some neck clear coat work. In any case, it was as good as new when it left the shop.
I'll have to check tomorrow at the office- I may have some photographs. One person who certainly knows all this history is Richard Davis.
The main problem is that Michael is not particularly familiar with Rickenbacker instruments and in the course of repair, the truss rods slots had become completely filled with glue, rendering the rods useless. One would think that Mark wouldn't have made such a mistake, given his familiarity with our instruments.
Grover took the fence off one of the small jointer planers we had and planed the fingerboard off, stopping just at the glue line. He had been wondering why he couldn't remove the rods and found out when the slots were completely visible at this point about the glue.
The break had large voids visible from the interior of the neck and slight signs of cracking on the exterior. Grover carefully partially broke the head off again, after having made some kerf cuts lengthwise over the break, mostly under the fingerboard. He put new strips of Maple in the kerfs, planed again, then glued the whole thing back together. The rods slots were cleaned up with a chisel and a new fingerboard installed.
I honestly don't recall whether we refinished it then or not but I think Grover was able to do this with only some neck clear coat work. In any case, it was as good as new when it left the shop.
I'll have to check tomorrow at the office- I may have some photographs. One person who certainly knows all this history is Richard Davis.
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vincent_gallo
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A great deal of the "Chris Squire sound" comes not from a choice of pickups, but from his technique. This is evidenced by his ability to produce a distinctive sound, on many non-Rickenbacker makes and models of basses, that our ears naturally identify as "Chris Squire" right away.
For one, he puts a great deal of impulse energy (amplitude) into the string attack itself. This is due to his characteristic use of a heavy Herco silver nylon pick, or equivalent,and his tremendous finger strength. He stops the string vibration with the side of his thumb almost immediately, thereby damping the string and creating a pizzicato attack on his fast work in sixteenths and the occasional thirty-seconds. And he springboards off the string energy by using strings rich in higher-order harmonics (the classic new-rotosound brightness that wears off after only twelve to twenty-four hours). Even finger-picking, to achieve a more rounded and softer attack, combined with his finger strength and left-hand dexterity, would yield a more energy-filled string attack and center, with a more biting finish, than more-traditional flatwounds that are long-dead (like most of us endure for budget reasons).
Feeding a traditional neck pickup, whether it is a Rick or a Mouradian or a Fenderish or a Lakland, this combo of strings and technique gives an unusually bright and rich sound, full of tasty and complex mids and low-highs, that is unlike any other sound I have heard from anyone, including Geddy.
With Chris, I can easily see where the 4001 bridge pickup would be non-critical to the "Chris Squire sound", and he could mix it in or take it out as it pleases him.
For one, he puts a great deal of impulse energy (amplitude) into the string attack itself. This is due to his characteristic use of a heavy Herco silver nylon pick, or equivalent,and his tremendous finger strength. He stops the string vibration with the side of his thumb almost immediately, thereby damping the string and creating a pizzicato attack on his fast work in sixteenths and the occasional thirty-seconds. And he springboards off the string energy by using strings rich in higher-order harmonics (the classic new-rotosound brightness that wears off after only twelve to twenty-four hours). Even finger-picking, to achieve a more rounded and softer attack, combined with his finger strength and left-hand dexterity, would yield a more energy-filled string attack and center, with a more biting finish, than more-traditional flatwounds that are long-dead (like most of us endure for budget reasons).
Feeding a traditional neck pickup, whether it is a Rick or a Mouradian or a Fenderish or a Lakland, this combo of strings and technique gives an unusually bright and rich sound, full of tasty and complex mids and low-highs, that is unlike any other sound I have heard from anyone, including Geddy.
With Chris, I can easily see where the 4001 bridge pickup would be non-critical to the "Chris Squire sound", and he could mix it in or take it out as it pleases him.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, and sit in with the band whenever you can, to keep your chops up!
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vincent_gallo
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It is true that Chris plays with somewhat of a distinctive technique and that his choice of strings adds to that outcome. It is nice that Elys has studied all this so closely and can bring it fourth here. However, it is mainly Chris Squires recorded sound that I fell most in love with. In the case of Chris’s best recorded sound I give a lot of credit to Eddie Offord the bands engineer and producer. Eddie Offord’s prime recordings with YES added to the Chris Squire sound as much as anything else did. Bill Bruford’s drumming as well had a lot of impact on Chris’s sound and feel. Further still, two bass players with the same technique and same instrument and amp set up could easily sound completely different. The main difference in their sound would come from what appealed to each player’s ears. Musicians fiddle with things until they hear something they like and that becomes their sound. Chris told me a funny story of the mixing of the second YES record. Chris said Steve Howe came by with him while they were mixing the Time And A Word LP (Steve had just joined) , and as they were sitting and listening to the mixing they noticed the bass level was way up in the mix. From where they were they could hear how high up the bass was but the producer didn’t notice either because he was deaf in the bass frequencies or from where he was mixing he did not hear the extra bass lift. Chris told me that he was loving it but that Steve Howe kept saying, “ the bass is a little high up don’t you think? ”. The sound of someone’s instrument in those days could come from a deaf mixer or the effect of the room in which music was mixed. Chris definitely used his bridge pick up. How much difference it made to his sound is questionable. He does say all the time that the thing he thinks most effects the sound of his bass is the wonderful little blue caps under his pick-guard.
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stevebasshead
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just_bassics
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What a great thread! Thanks Elys, Vincent, John Hall and others for sharing so much of your experiences.
This all reminds me of an interview I read years ago with David Gilmore. David was asked about his signature sound and how he gets it; his answer was a little surprising. In essence, he said "I know this is going to disappoint a lot of people, but you know those little boxes that sit on the floor? Well, I just twist all the knobs until I like what I hear!"
I'm fairly certain that if you handed just about any bass and amp to Chris Squire, he'd break out some Rotosounds, twiddle the knobs and in a few minutes, you would be hearing the Squire sound. The fact that he chooses Rickenbacker (mainly) and a particular amp does give some great insight into just what sound he's looking for, but I still think Chris's magic comes from the fact that he was first and foremost a singer and then vocal arranger. After listening to him and YES for thirty five years now, I've arrived at the conclusion that Chris plays on his bass what he cannot sing with his voice and that is the reason that so much of his bass writing stands apart from the crowd. It's just so very musical and lyrical. I don't know of any other musician that has this approach and the result is pleasingly original, no matter what the situation. He has been criticized by fellow musicians for taking so long to work out a part, but even Bruford admits that it's usually those bass parts that make the song work. Look at "Long Distance runaround" for one example. Take out Chris's part and it's an entirely different song (as the much maligned QPR version suggests).
To address another thread under this topic, I believe that Chris Squire and Justin Hayward would be a mighty combination... if those two ever started writing together, watch out! I can't even imagine how great that would sound! (IMO, of course) And the classic Squire tone would be present in a manner consistent with the music. Those of you who know Chris must keep encouraging him to write more material, be it with Yes, Sherwood, Syn or solo - it's all good! I hope that there is a surprise for all of us with next year's 40th YES anniversary. Perhaps something as vocally strong as "Magnification" with a generous helping of "Fragile" on the instrumental side.
As a Sound Engineer, I'm as interested as the next guy as to whether the bass knob was set to "5" or "6" on a given record, but when it comes to YES music, I try to forget all that and just listen. I'm much more interested in where the music itself originates. If I try to reverse engineer one of Eddie Offord's masterful mixes, I still don't find the answers because for me, the magic happens when they write and arrange the song. There is too little insight into where that comes from... as a songwriter myself, I just hope to find my own sources of inspiration and meet my own expectations, which, because of Yes music, have become so high... Man, I'd better get back to work!
This all reminds me of an interview I read years ago with David Gilmore. David was asked about his signature sound and how he gets it; his answer was a little surprising. In essence, he said "I know this is going to disappoint a lot of people, but you know those little boxes that sit on the floor? Well, I just twist all the knobs until I like what I hear!"
I'm fairly certain that if you handed just about any bass and amp to Chris Squire, he'd break out some Rotosounds, twiddle the knobs and in a few minutes, you would be hearing the Squire sound. The fact that he chooses Rickenbacker (mainly) and a particular amp does give some great insight into just what sound he's looking for, but I still think Chris's magic comes from the fact that he was first and foremost a singer and then vocal arranger. After listening to him and YES for thirty five years now, I've arrived at the conclusion that Chris plays on his bass what he cannot sing with his voice and that is the reason that so much of his bass writing stands apart from the crowd. It's just so very musical and lyrical. I don't know of any other musician that has this approach and the result is pleasingly original, no matter what the situation. He has been criticized by fellow musicians for taking so long to work out a part, but even Bruford admits that it's usually those bass parts that make the song work. Look at "Long Distance runaround" for one example. Take out Chris's part and it's an entirely different song (as the much maligned QPR version suggests).
To address another thread under this topic, I believe that Chris Squire and Justin Hayward would be a mighty combination... if those two ever started writing together, watch out! I can't even imagine how great that would sound! (IMO, of course) And the classic Squire tone would be present in a manner consistent with the music. Those of you who know Chris must keep encouraging him to write more material, be it with Yes, Sherwood, Syn or solo - it's all good! I hope that there is a surprise for all of us with next year's 40th YES anniversary. Perhaps something as vocally strong as "Magnification" with a generous helping of "Fragile" on the instrumental side.
As a Sound Engineer, I'm as interested as the next guy as to whether the bass knob was set to "5" or "6" on a given record, but when it comes to YES music, I try to forget all that and just listen. I'm much more interested in where the music itself originates. If I try to reverse engineer one of Eddie Offord's masterful mixes, I still don't find the answers because for me, the magic happens when they write and arrange the song. There is too little insight into where that comes from... as a songwriter myself, I just hope to find my own sources of inspiration and meet my own expectations, which, because of Yes music, have become so high... Man, I'd better get back to work!
You can never own too many guitars!
The standard tone (RC filter network) capacitors that came stock under the PG of a 1964 4001 were blue axial-lead caps (I am actually holding a few NOS ones in my hand right now as I type, spares for a few 1964 4001s and RM1999 basses and two 1965 4001s that are here in my collection). It matters not what color they were or brand or shape as to their performance or sound (that is professional electronics engineering fact, you can "feel" about it whatever you wish), all that matters is the capacitance and the overall reactance of the capacitors themselves, as far as sound goes. Electro just used a particular brand and color back then, and it is an earmark of originality in an early 4001 to find this particular brand and production run. Here is a photo of an accurate 1964 4001 with the blue caps:
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, and sit in with the band whenever you can, to keep your chops up!
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lyle_from_minneapolis
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It's interesting that many of us instantly recognize the sound of a 4001 or RM1999... But then again, do we?
Many of us have been surprised by the Rickenbacker sounds on the White Album that were actually a Jazz Bass. One example, the tail end of Helter Skelter...sure sounds like the Rick, but it isn't. (To be clear, he DOES use the Rick on many White Album tracks, but not that track.)
So tweaking levels and effects, as well as a player's technique, can deliver the goods that a Rickenbacker does on it's own. And a brilliant player like Squire could probably do it with...well, a Squier.
Many of us have been surprised by the Rickenbacker sounds on the White Album that were actually a Jazz Bass. One example, the tail end of Helter Skelter...sure sounds like the Rick, but it isn't. (To be clear, he DOES use the Rick on many White Album tracks, but not that track.)
So tweaking levels and effects, as well as a player's technique, can deliver the goods that a Rickenbacker does on it's own. And a brilliant player like Squire could probably do it with...well, a Squier.
Here is where I hide my music:
http://www.soundclick.com/MarkKaufman
http://www.soundclick.com/MarkKaufman
If so, John, it would not be because of the differing types of capacitor technology. It would be because the tolerances of their actual versus labeled capacitance values differed within the 10 to 20 percent normally allowed for standard quality capacitors.
By definition, their filter characteristics, and therefore the "sound" that resulted, would be exactly the same, as long as the capacitance value was the same and the reactance (meaning the internal resistance portion) of the capacitors was equal.
That's the way electronics works, it is an exact science.
What you "hear" is actually different values for the capacitors, because a particular production run trends to different actual values within the tolerance ranges of their average values in production.
By the way, non-polar electrolytics are actually composed of TWO individual regular polar capacitors, soldered together at the plus terminal, and the resulting combination has exactly half the capacitance value of either of the two identical capacitors that form the pair. You get much larger capacitance value variations in production with such a type of cap, as well as internal resistance variations.
By definition, their filter characteristics, and therefore the "sound" that resulted, would be exactly the same, as long as the capacitance value was the same and the reactance (meaning the internal resistance portion) of the capacitors was equal.
That's the way electronics works, it is an exact science.
What you "hear" is actually different values for the capacitors, because a particular production run trends to different actual values within the tolerance ranges of their average values in production.
By the way, non-polar electrolytics are actually composed of TWO individual regular polar capacitors, soldered together at the plus terminal, and the resulting combination has exactly half the capacitance value of either of the two identical capacitors that form the pair. You get much larger capacitance value variations in production with such a type of cap, as well as internal resistance variations.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, and sit in with the band whenever you can, to keep your chops up!
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gearhed289
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>>>Many of us have been surprised by the Rickenbacker sounds on the White Album that were actually a Jazz Bass. One example, the tail end of Helter Skelter...sure sounds like the Rick, but it isn't. (To be clear, he DOES use the Rick on many White Album tracks, but not that track.)<<<
And just to clarify, it was Lennon on bass for that track.
Moving Pictures by Rush is another good example of this.
Also, I often play a Les Paul with Thunderbird pickups, and it ends up sounding very Ric-like.
And just to clarify, it was Lennon on bass for that track.
Moving Pictures by Rush is another good example of this.
Also, I often play a Les Paul with Thunderbird pickups, and it ends up sounding very Ric-like.
'89 4003S, '92 4001CS, '93 4003S/8
www.nomadichorizonband.com
www.nomadichorizonband.com
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jwr2
A big reason the 4001 has it's distinctive sound is that from the 1960s thru 1989 they had single coil pickups with 500k ohm tone pots ... whereas most basses with single coil pickups have 250k ohm pots for tone and volume ... that is why my old 68 still screamed with the .0047 capacitor removed and 4003 high gain pickups installed ...
you can make a jazz bass sound like a ric by turning all of the knobs to 10 and then rolling off the bridge pickup volume ...
you can make a jazz bass sound like a ric by turning all of the knobs to 10 and then rolling off the bridge pickup volume ...