Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

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maxwell
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Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by maxwell »

I have a Model 1996 AFG (2006 reissue) that has some problems. One is that the strings are simply too high to be adjusted, i.e., I have to raise the bridge at max just to have the saddles touch the strings. Of course, in this case there is no way to lower the action across the fret board. I've considered several options to modify my Accent Vibrato, etc., over the too-many years this thing has sat in its case. It occurred to me that by installing a Bigsby, this would guide the strings over the bridge at a more acute (steep) angle, and if that were not quite enough at the typical Bigsby placement (position) of about 5/16" or so from the guitar bottom edge, I could slightly move the Bigsby up an inch or so to increase the steepness of the string break angle.

My questions:

1. Will the internal construction of the 1996 reissue allow for securely installing a Bigsby?

2. Can anyone recommend a Rick-experience luthier in the Austin, TX area who could not only do this in his sleep, but also address neck issue(s) and possibly correct these in conjunction (or instead of) the Bigsby installation? These are somewhat subtle deficiencies that make the guitar practically unplayable; I think only someone who could, e.g., reset a Rick neck and do similar major repairs would be able to do this and not make it worse.

Bored? Want to read a summary of my tale of woe?

http://www.rickenbacker.com/forum/viewt ... =2&t=16298

No one there offered any advice, although they were all kind enough not to suggest that I was SOL.... Any suggestions or comments welcome, although I really need a good Rick repair luthier to bail me out in/near Austin.
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jdogric12
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by jdogric12 »

That's a bummer. Too bad it didn't get sorted out during the warranty period. I think you may be screwed. The good news is a Bigsby B5 should be just fine... it works on all the 325 models, so this one should be no different.
maxwell
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by maxwell »

Thanks for the reply. No..., no warranty period for this -- I bought it used, one of those "buyer beware" deals except that I was far too ignorant back then to realize the problems; again, they weren't real obvious. I learned a lot (an expensive education), and had I not experienced this stuff already, I'd probably still would not be able to pick up on the deficiencies today.

The seller had these really large strings on it, almost like bass strings. Eventually I realized that these thick strings needed a high degree of tension to tune up. What this high tension did was pull (stretch) the Accent spring flatter, allowing it to lie lower (closer) to the guitar face, and effectively changing the break angle of the strings over the bridge allowing for decent string-bridge contact. I've thought about buying another spring and flattening it further in a big vice, but I don't think it will give me the bridge adjustment range I need/want.

This problem of the strings simply being too "high" is not unique to me. I've done a lot of reading, and have noted similar accounts; not many, but they're out there, e.g., mentioned somewhere on this web site. I wasn't sure how "hollow" this guitar was, so I wanted to confirm that a Bigsby could be securely installed. I assume the guitar is a semi-hollow with a decent sized center block within...?

I guess I'll buy a B5 and experiment with its placement.

I'm still hoping someone can recommend a luthier in Austin. I've searched the web "yellow pages" and two different guys invariably pop up in the results. One guy has a photo of a customer with his Rick bass in hand on his home page, but that's all I have to go on for making a decision. I really need an informed opinion as to who can work on these unique guitars.
stringsncords
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by stringsncords »

It sounds like you may have to go non-local and send the guitar to a recommended Rick luthier somewhere in the US - it may be a better option than experimenting with a B5 yourself.

I've purchased - and have had several adjustments - at Pick of the Ricks in NJ; perhaps a call to Chris Clayton (856) 782-7300 will yield some good information. He's in at 1 pm Tues-Sat.

If Chris can't fix it himself, perhaps he can recommend another good Rickenbacker luthier. It could be a neck-straightening issue. Best of luck!
maxwell
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by maxwell »

Thanks. I'll give it some time before I start making out-of-state inquiries. The experimenting would be limited to me simply placing/centering the Bigsby on the face of the guitar (protecting the surface) and using a piece if dental floss (as a very flexible "string") to evaluate the break angles, bridge height adjustments, etc., (allowing for possibly slight bowing of the neck under string tension) as I move the Bigsby forward from its typical placement.

As I move the Bigsby forward (closer) to the bridge, the string spacing will become greater. I was considering putting a new roller bridge on it (it came with a POS substitute). I do have the typical RIC bridge with the un-notched saddles, and this is probably the best bet, as I would be able to account for the slightly atypical string spacing, as the saddles can be notched right where the strings freely rest on them when strung. I am optimistically assuming that both E stings will remain comfortably over the fretboard.

Surprisingly, there's not a lot of Bigsby B5 installation videos on Ricks on YouTube... well, actually, none that I could find. If I had a good video review, I might try this myself. I am a "measure twice, cut once" kind of guy and wouldn't drill any holes until 100% sure of the Bigsby position.

I'll order the B5 from ebay soon and do my experimenting. It's always nice to be able to have an intelligent give & take conversation with the luthier when it gets to that point.

In the mean time, I'll hope for more replies here.
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jdogric12
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by jdogric12 »

A B5 is normal on a 325v59 so just look to pics of those as your guide and you should be fine.
maxwell
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by maxwell »

Thanks. I was sort of focusing on the Bigsby installation feasibility because it seems that nearly all Bigsbys seem to be limited to the '58 & '59 models (as they are designed, of course). Somewhere I thought I read that the '58 was a solid body, and thought that the '59 could be the same. This, along with the fact that I could not find any used '64s for sale (e.g., eBay, Reverb) with a Bigsby, suggested to me that the trem conversion was not possible.

Interestingly, I think I recently read something posted by Mr. Hall over on the RIC Forum about securing a trem (Kaufman?) with machine screws with fasteners (nuts?) on the inside of the hollow body to ensure stability. At least, this could be a plan to correct a loose Bigsby retaining screw. I'll have to go over and try to find that post.

I suppose most guys don't make this Bigsby mod in order to maintain the authenticity of their guitar. Understandable, and this was me until a few days ago. At the rate I'm going now, this Rick will end up in my estate sale before I get to enjoy it. :?
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jdogric12
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by jdogric12 »

That's right, 325's never left the factory with a Bigsby until the V59's in the 80's. John Lennon just screwed his on himself. The bit about putting nuts on the inside makes sense. The 325 is not solid, it's semi hollow. You might be able to put nuts underneath... a lot of guys have "Lennonized" C58's, maybe search around and see if anyone's detailed their process and/or shared their results?
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jps
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by jps »

maxwell wrote:...At the rate I'm going now, this Rick will end up in my estate sale before I get to enjoy it. :?
Will it be offered for cheap? :twisted:
maxwell
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Re: Bigsby B5 on Rose Morris (2006) model 1996 AFG reissue?

Post by maxwell »

jps wrote:
maxwell wrote:...At the rate I'm going now, this Rick will end up in my estate sale before I get to enjoy it. :?
Will it be offered for cheap? :twisted:
I have visions of all my guitars being piled onto a pallet and sold off as a lot for $200... :(
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