Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

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Tommy
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Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by Tommy »

Can anybody explain why and how the Rose Morris Rickenbackers had an f-shaped soundhole and not the classic slash?

Why do that?
And how? (Was it done in the States and shipped over or done over there?)
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jdogric12
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by jdogric12 »

According to all the books, it's simply something Rose-Morris asked for.

From rosemorris.com via google search:
Posted on July 21, 2014
1964 found the Beatles at their very pinnacle of fame. From Buckingham Palace to Shea Stadium, the mop-topped lads from Liverpool spread Beatlemania throughout the world transforming polite young citizens into screaming hords of rabid rock fans.

The Rose Morris Rickenbacker was as much a part of The Beatles early sound as the Vox amps they made so famous. The trademark jangley sound was in full effect with this perfect pairing and worked in perfect tandem with their look and vocal style. Classy and cool.

Though Rickenbacker was an American company, they did customize the Rose Morris additions with a more traditional f-hole to appeal to the Europeon market. Thus, history was written with a legendary brand, supplier and band!
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Tommy
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by Tommy »

jdogric12 wrote:...with a more traditional f-hole to appeal to the Europeon market. ...
Interesting. I wonder why that would have an appeal to a certain market.
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wim
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by wim »

being European I can't say I like it.
Maybe the English buyers?
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collin
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by collin »

Tommy wrote:
jdogric12 wrote:...with a more traditional f-hole to appeal to the Europeon market. ...
Interesting. I wonder why that would have an appeal to a certain market.
From what I understand, yes --the f-hole and dot inlays were done to appeal to more traditional English buyers. In hindsight, semi-hollow guitars were still relatively new in 1964 (<10 years) and virtually all of them had f-shaped soundholes.

Perhaps Rose Morris didn't want to gamble ordering models with the slash-shaped soundhole if f-holes were proven sellers on other guitar models?

The other specifications could have been requested to keep the costs down. Both the RM1995 (615) and RM1999 (4001S) were the downmarket versions of their respective models, and the RM1993 had more in common with the 330/12 than it did the deluxe 360/12.

Supposedly, the RM1993 sample sent to Rose Morris in '64 was a 360/12 with a traditional f-hole (this prototype became Pete Townshend's first 12-string, but that's another story altogether!), so the company clearly rejected deluxe features on the production models.
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Tommy
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by Tommy »

collin wrote:From what I understand...
Good stuff.

Yes, if semi-hollows were relatively new then I can see not wanting to offer up something radical (is a slash hole really radical, though?).

Interesting about Pete's prototype Ric. I wonder if he smashed it.
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collin
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by collin »

Tommy wrote:
Interesting about Pete's prototype Ric. I wonder if he smashed it.
That he did, unfortunately.

It's on the far left of the famous "Wall of Ricks" photo (note the unique TRC shape, these were all individual in early '64, not a standardized shape).
IMG_0597.jpg
There are at least three of these 360S/12 guitars that I know of, I'd guess five or less made. Pete's is the only one I know of that went to the U.K. so it had to be the prototype. Also see page 91 of Richard Smith's Rickenbacker book. Might be the same guitar.

This was the guitar used to record "I Can't Explain," and "Anyway Anyhow Anywhere," and possibly even the entire My Generation album 12-string parts. Shame this one was demolished (and then lost).
1965_412bassmanpro_1.jpg
Pete -01.jpg
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8mileshigher
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Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by 8mileshigher »

Great insights there, Collin !
Tubwompus
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by Tubwompus »

To hear Dave Gregory (XTC) speak of it, the dots, lack of a Rick-O-Sound input, and traditional F-hole were a disappointment to British fellas in’64 who thought they were ordering a 360/12 like George’s.
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by johnhall »

As it happens, I was reviewing the original Rose Morris contract yesterday with a writer that's doing the "definitive Rickenbacker book". They specifically required that all of their instruments have F-holes, dot inlays, and a few other quirky requirements. Who knows why but as the customer, I guess it was their choice and we deferred to their presumed knowledge of the market.
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collin
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by collin »

Thanks John, great news that a new “definitive” Rickenbacker book is in the works. It’s long overdue!
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godber
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by godber »

I thought (hoped) that you would be writing that book Collin.
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Kiddwad57
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by Kiddwad57 »

&quot;f&quot; 'n' argyle
"f" 'n' argyle
Because it goes well with "traditional argyle" Vox grill cloth?
Don't let democracy end democracy.
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collin
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by collin »

godber wrote:I thought (hoped) that you would be writing that book Collin.
Ha! Thanks Mark.

My scope of interest is way too narrow, though. Unless anybody wants a book that is ONLY about the Rose Morris export models? :lol:
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jps
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Re: Why The Rose Morris F-Hole?

Post by jps »

collin wrote:
godber wrote:I thought (hoped) that you would be writing that book Collin.
Ha! Thanks Mark.

My scope of interest is way too narrow, though. Unless anybody wants a book that is ONLY about the Rose Morris export models? :lol:
I'm sure there's room for that. 8)
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