Sound Affects.

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Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:03 pm

Seems that these guys are now official Rickenbacker stockists, or as they put it...."the UK’s leading Rickenbacker specialists". :roll:
I checked on the Rosetti dealer list and they are on it.
Their used Ric prices are on the optimistic side, but their new prices seem Ok in a middle of the road sort of way, but beware of them selling you a 'New' Rickenbacker that has actually already been sold before and returned to Rosetti as damaged/faulty.
Any reports from people that have dealt with these guys would be most welcome.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (scotty) » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:29 pm

I was going to post about this the other night as i noticed they have some new Lennon models in.Im presuming that these are few of the stock that J Hall was referring to in another thread.I think they are quite careful in telling you that the item is returned or B stock but you do need to read all the wording before you buy.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:07 pm

scotty wrote:I was going to post about this the other night as i noticed they have some new Lennon models in.Im presuming that these are few of the stock that J Hall was referring to in another thread.I think they are quite careful in telling you that the item is returned or B stock but you do need to read all the wording before you buy.


If we're talking about the same guitars, I found the wording to be misleading from the point of view that they made it sound like they had originally sold the guitar and it was returned to them as faulty. This was certainly not the case with at least one of the guitars as we know it was originally sold by another shop.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (scotty) » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:26 pm

I know about the 660 they were selling as it was B stock but i cant comment any further at this juncture as im engaged in numpty antics on FB :lol:
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (Hotzenplotz) » Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:12 am

My 330/6 MID is from them at any time again. - Good prices, good service and very friendly!

So I can recommend them based on my my experiences.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 3:40 pm

They claim...."This Guitar is New"
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rickenbacker- ... 2327wt_934


Oh no it isn't...........
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=400713

And it's been sold by another dealer as well.....
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Rickenbacker-370- ... 2964wt_825

So ladies and Gentlemen. We have the first ever 'brand new' Rickenbacker that has already been owned by 3 different people..... :roll: :lol:
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (Hotzenplotz) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 3:54 pm

Once again that odd axe...

It was me that gave it back. I did not play it.

As I know it returned to the importer Rosetti. Then the other store offered it (very expensive!), maybe they gave it back to Rosetti, too.

Now it seems to be back to Sound Affects. So it must still be unplayed - and that means new.
The guitar itself is very good - except the clear coated (and embarrassing) missing paint - done in the factory.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:57 pm

Hotzenplotz wrote:Once again that odd axe...

It was me that gave it back. I did not play it.

As I know it returned to the importer Rosetti. Then the other store offered it (very expensive!), maybe they gave it back to Rosetti, too.

Now it seems to be back to Sound Affects. So it must still be unplayed - and that means new.
The guitar itself is very good - except the clear coated (and embarrassing) missing paint - done in the factory.


Hi Sascha.
Once purchased the guitar can no longer be described as new. The fact that you didn't play it has no bearing on this.
Regardless, this seems to be a bit of a very well travelled Rickenbacker.
I wonder where it will turn up next. :roll: :lol:
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (Hotzenplotz) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:58 pm

Well, Sound Affects provides "make offer"-option on eBay. I would try that.

Or You call the owner directly. He is a very friendly man. I am very satisfied with the service of him. For me it was quite easy to give that guitar back. - Without hesitation at all! Although it was the second one I gave back!

This guitar is a strange thing: At RIC they painted it with clear coat on missing blue varnish. (Good morning!?) After that somebody spent a lot of energy in covering that mistake with a marker, "good" work, so far. It was not visible at first appearance. Because I had sent the "sister" of this back (made the same day - it had peeling varnish at the neck binding) I was looking closer. Then I mentioned the mistake. That maker was removed carfully for showing it to Rosetti. As I know they were really surprised, too. And embarrassed, too.

If I had something to decide at RIC I would buy it back.

Btw., sometimes people talk about two different qualities: one better for the US market and one for the rest of the world. My experience now just allows to say that this is not just a rumour. I am sorry for that. - Normally they have to repair for warranty, wouldn't they?

But the guitar itself is good, except that small (and funny) faux pas. Maybe a paint shop for cars can repair that easily. I do not know. In the end it depends from the price. :wink:

And: Now this guitar became already very famous before it was played at all! :lol:

But we are talking about two different things simultaneously. Sound Affects is a really good dealer, as I sad before. That was the original question. If You like a guitar with a strange story and a small mistake You have to decide for yourself.

My first new bought Rickenbacker had to be perfect. That was my reason for sending back.

If I had more than one Rickenbacker I would buy it for a good price and then send it back to RIC. Then they can paint it one more time or Mr. Hall can sign it at least with the add-on: "We are sorry!" :lol: :lol: :lol:
Both ways will raise the value.

Most important: everybody around the world knows what's with that guitar. It is written in the desciption. Nobody tried to sell a B-stock as a regular one. - Except RIC itself...
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:48 pm

Hotzenplotz wrote:Well, Sound Affects provides "make offer"-option on eBay. I would try that.

Or You call the owner directly. He is a very friendly man. I am very satisfied with the service of him. For me it was quite easy to give that guitar back. - Without hesitation at all! Although it was the second one I gave back!

This guitar is a strange thing: At RIC they painted it with clear coat on missing blue varnish. (Good morning!?) After that somebody spent a lot of energy in covering that mistake with a marker, "good" work, so far. It was not visible at first appearance. Because I had sent the "sister" of this back (made the same day - it had peeling varnish at the neck binding) I was looking closer. Then I mentioned the mistake. That maker was removed carfully for showing it to Rosetti. As I know they were really surprised, too. And embarrassed, too.

If I had something to decide at RIC I would buy it back.

Btw., sometimes people talk about two different qualities: one better for the US market and one for the rest of the world. My experience now just allows to say that this is not just a rumour. I am sorry for that. - Normally they have to repair for warranty, wouldn't they?

But the guitar itself is good, except that small (and funny) faux pas. Maybe a paint shop for cars can repair that easily. I do not know. In the end it depends from the price. :wink:

And: Now this guitar became already very famous before it was played at all! :lol:

But we are talking about two different things simultaneously. Sound Affects is a really good dealer, as I sad before. That was the original question. If You like a guitar with a strange story and a small mistake You have to decide for yourself.

My first new bought Rickenbacker had to be perfect. That was my reason for sending back.

If I had more than one Rickenbacker I would buy it for a good price and then send it back to RIC. Then they can paint it one more time or Mr. Hall can sign it at least with the add-on: "We are sorry!" :lol: :lol: :lol:
Both ways will raise the value.

Most important: everybody around the world knows what's with that guitar. It is written in the desciption. Nobody tried to sell a B-stock as a regular one. - Except RIC itself...


With regards to Rickenbacker guitars, I've never heard anyone speak of 'one quality for the US and another for the rest of the world' before. That's just complete nonsense, and that sounds like Fender fanboy speak to me.
Every guitar built at Santa Ana goes through the same rigorous process and is built to the same exacting standards. Considering the amount of 'hands on' work that goes into each guitar, it's amazing how few Rickenbacker guitars with faults/defects actually make it out of the factory. The quality control is top notch, and is actually probably second to none when it comes to major guitar manufacturers.

You seem to have the idea that Rickenbacker knowingly sent this guitar out in it's present condition. This is more complete nonsense.
It would make absolutely no financial sense whatsoever for them to do so. Do you think that they would be that desperate to sell this one guitar? :roll:
With regards to the 'defect' on this 370. Who's to say that it actually left the Rickenbacker factory in that condition?
It could have been damaged at some point after it left the factory and someone has tried a bodge job to cover it up. Lord knows it's been in so many peoples hands along the way. who knows the real story behind the damage?
Just a thought.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (Hotzenplotz) » Sun Jul 24, 2011 9:25 pm

To make it clear at first: If I play an electric guitar it has to be a Rickenbacker. It is the sound, the design, the feeling.
I love these guitars!!!

But that special guitar came from the factory with that mistake. I am the one who has seen that. It is not an idea, opinion or whatever. We talk about experience, I had it in my hands. And it was easy to see that the perfect clear varnish was over a not coloured area. Nothing that was scratched away from the transport. I took a loupe to make it clear. It was not a repair with clear varnish. The surface of the varnish was without any edge or something that can identify a past factory repair.

For every car painter it is a daily job to mix colours for perfect results. It is not a kind of magic at all.
By the way it does not make sense: If somebody is able to do such a perfect repair of the clear coat the same one is able to mix the perfect fitting colour. - And THEN to cover it with clear varnish. But the marker was on (!) the virgin clear varnish. No difference in the surface, too.

And the first guitar I sent back had also problems with the paintwork! The serial number was a few numbers before, same colour. Maybe the pressure to produce guitars as fast as possible is creating mistakes like these on very, very rare occasions.

Only RIC can solve that mystery finally. I think they should speak the last word about it.

To repeat it one more time: Sound Affects satisfied me completely. And that was the main thing in this thread. I trust them. My next Rickenbacker will be from them, too. Even if I have to wait years for it. - And they offer it clearly as an unused B-stock. It is distributed a bit more than a normal Rickenbacker, but unused. In my eyes a 100% honest offer.

Now, since a few month, I own my "love at first sight guitar". I won't give it away ever. Strange: although it has no wear at all it started to create a special mojo (for me!). I have already written a few songs with it. No other guitar felt like this before. And I play since over 25 years and had a Rickenbacker before for 15 years (and it was not the "right" one in the end).

Maybe this whole thing happened to receive MY Rickenbacker guitar. A similar story to John Lennons first Rickenbacker. As I know it was a pre series without a soundhole (the Rose Morrises had the soundhole, right?), stored two years at the factory and changed to a four knob layout during that storage. (Is that right?) Then a german dealer ordered exactly the guitar he has seen at a trade show long time before. A poor and young Lennon bought it in Hamburg - and made the brand famous like no other. With that special and rare guitar. What a coincidence!
I think Rickenbackers find their players, not the players find their Rickenbackers. Stories like these I can not imagine with Fenders or others.
And maybe that "strange" 370/12 MID is taking the long way home to the right one now, too. And maybe RAS and the ownership of over 20 Rickenbackers is the (expensive) way to the one and only. I am sure everybody who owns a lot of Rickenbackers has one favorite, not exactly knowing why it is of all things the Cinderella in an expensive collection. O.K., it sounds a bit fairytale-like. But maybe it goes a bit that way.

Back to the two different qualities: there are some who think that, even in this forum. After two guitars with finish problems I can understand that a bit more now. Before I did not. - And german Rickenbacker dealers tell that, too! But sure, what I have seen or heard is not representative for the whole production of thousands of guitars over the decades.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (SoundAffectsMusic) » Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:05 pm

Hi ,Tim at Sound Affects here. Thought I’d chip in on this one to try and clarify a few points if I may. Please excuse the lengthy response, but it’s a tale worth telling:

This guitar was sent to us by Rosetti as a replacement for a previously faulty 370/12 which we had sold to a good customer (Hotzenplotz - Sascha). On his previous guitar the lacquer had flaked away from the binding after a few months; quite minor, but a defect nevertheless and we and Rosetti were happy to resolve the issue.

When we received his replacement 370/12 we inspected it as we always do and found no issues, so sent it on to Sascha. He was happy on receipt, but almost immediately he polished the guitar and found an issue. There was an area on the bottom of the guitar that had no paint. This had been covered over but was easily revealed with a quick polish. It appears as though it had been over-buffed at the production stage before the final lacquer was applied, but not noticed. Once fully lacquered it had a thin coat blown over it, or Sascha felt maybe a marker – I personally think the former is true. But the finish is like glass. You cannot feel it, its just clear lacquer over unfinished wood – strange….

Sascha immediately informed us, but we struggled to understand it, until, as requested he returned the guitar for us to see. Once we had the guitar back we immediately resolved the issue for Sascha, who by this time had had is fill of 370/12’s and asked if we would instead replace with a 330/6 again in midnight and some toasters and a few other bits he required – we were happy to help. So I can see why readers may find it difficult to visualise the defect – we did too.

I personally think this guitar did indeed leave the factory in this state. Maybe somebody panicked and covered over the defect – who knows?

We sent the guitar back to Rosetti for them to inspect. Their conclusion was the same as ours, albeit they had never seen this before. They asked if we would like to buy the guitar as a B Stock at a reduced price, but we declined (politely) feeling that the asking price was a little on the high side.

Rosetti then allowed another shop to advertise the guitar as B Stock, but they never actually bought it and were unsuccessful in finding a buyer at the price they were asking.

Two weeks ago we went down to Rosetti and bought a large number of Ricks, one of which was this 370/12 – the first time that we or any other shop has bought it. This time the price was right :D

Rosetti are treating it as new, although quite rightly B Stock. The new element is quite important. Although I acknowledge it has travelled to Germany and back, it is still new in that it has a full warranty (excluding the known defect) and we are the first buyer. Many people will buy a guitar that has been on a wall and played many times as“new” or one where a customer has exercised their rights under the distance selling laws to return a guitar within 7 days – again it would be regarded by most people as “new”. It is a tough one, but I don’t think that treating this guitar as new we are in any way trying to mislead – we do state its B Stock and it does have a warranty. We don’t actually display many of our Ricks due to a shortage of space, but will only ever sell a guitar as new if it is free from any defect or we explicitly state otherwise.

Just in regards to B Stock, whilst I agree that Rickenbacker’s QC is second to none, some guitars do slip through. Its rare and I should know as we get offered the majority them – very small numbers. I don’t think in any way it’s a UK vs US thing as implied – it’s just that mistakes do happen.

The other thing that’s worth clarifying (although I’m guessing most people know) is that for a UK purchaser the only warranty that a UK buyer will get is with a Rosetti supplied guitar and the warranty is with them. Equally they have no recourse to Rickenbacker. This doesn’t seem to worry them as the numbers are so very small, and they like us are proud to be associated with such a prestigious brand. So this guitar has never been back to the US for diagnosis, and they will be unaware of the problem.

Anyway I hope that clarifies some points on this guitar and once again apologies for the lengthy post. Happy to answer any questions.

Tim
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (fireglo67) » Fri Jul 29, 2011 3:39 am

Thanks for taking the time to clear that one up for us.
I suppose it will be down to the individual to decide whether a guitar that has been sold, sent to Germany and then returned is still technically 'new'. It's just a shame that these details weren't included in the Ebay listing, but it's good that a lot of prospective buyers now know the true and peculiar history of this guitar.

SoundAffectsMusic wrote:
The other thing that’s worth clarifying (although I’m guessing most people know) is that for a UK purchaser the only warranty that a UK buyer will get is with a Rosetti supplied guitar and the warranty is with them. Equally they have no recourse to Rickenbacker. This doesn’t seem to worry them as the numbers are so very small, and they like us are proud to be associated with such a prestigious brand. So this guitar has never been back to the US for diagnosis, and they will be unaware of the problem.



John Hall and various Rickenbacker employees are regular contributors to this forum, so I'm sure that they are aware of this guitar.
Actually, I could be wrong, but I'm sure John Hall once said a few years ago that Rosetti have to send a report back to Rickenbacker about any defective guitars returned to them.

Thanks again and the best of luck selling the 370/12.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (johnhall) » Fri Jul 29, 2011 11:13 am

We're more than mystified, especially when you consider the last 370/12 Mid was made on April 13, 2010.

I find it hard to believe that any guitar with a defect as glaring as this could get through three levels of inspection here, and then past the very critical inspection Rosetti performs on all instruments.

Rather than a buff through, it's quite obvious this is an abrasion, especially when you see that flaky bit. This may have heppened at any time in transit, storage or display. While I suppose someone may have clear coated it, it's much more likely it's been repolished, such that the clear sealer coats have been brought up to a gloss.

SoundAffectsMusic wrote:The other thing that’s worth clarifying (although I’m guessing most people know) is that for a UK purchaser the only warranty that a UK buyer will get is with a Rosetti supplied guitar and the warranty is with them. Equally they have no recourse to Rickenbacker.


While it is true that each of our distributors must necessarily administer the warranty locally in order to conform to regional law and custom, they do have recourse to us and we take care of them in a manner appropriate to the situation, ranging from replacement to parts swap.

Lastly, there is no difference between instruments in the domestic and international instruments; it's only the last second luck of which label that goes on what guitar in the shipping department that determines where it lands.
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Re: Sound Affects.

Postby (Hotzenplotz) » Fri Jul 29, 2011 12:35 pm

johnhall wrote:We're more than mystified, especially when you consider the last 370/12 Mid was made on April 13, 2010.


Well, the serial number of this guitar is 10118xx. The first given back guitar also started with 10118xx. The 11th week of 2011 started April, 14.
!?!
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