'64' RM199 rebuild continued, detective work.... (seeking 64 jack plate).

[corduroyboy]

This is a follow-up on my post from 2019, below; I dismantled and rebuilt what turned out to be (probably) a 64 RM1999.

viewtopic.php?t=415905

I've toured, recorded it and loved it, since my rebuild.

HOWEVER, I am intrigued, to say the least, about it's history; who treated this bass so badly ?
Who pieced the pieces back together, painted it rattle can red and the scratch plate white ?

Possibly someone smashed it up on stage, not so easy to smash it in two halves; does anyone know of anyone doing this?
Or a tragic accident; a piano fell out of a two story window onto a passing Rickenbacker... ?

I have a theory that possibly the previous owner played in a Hawkwind or Motorhead covers band.

I've never see another Rick with the lug on the heel; Lemmy always did. Anyone ?

Also the bass appears to have been modded to fit a Rickosound Stereo jack, like Lemmy - but why the crosshair hacksaw attack ?

Possibly someone attempted to sell this bass, with its brass scratch plate, as one of Lemmy's basses and the dealer smashed it up because it's a 'fake Lemmy bass' - thoughts ?

Finally, somebody suggested in my original thread that I replace the 73 jack plate with a 64; can anyone help with that please?

Thanks
R

[Tache3]

I've never see another Rick with the lug on the heel; Lemmy always did. Anyone ?

I did that to one of mine for a while. Pretty much because of Lemmy.

Its not a good idea, it makes the guitar seriously neck heavy with the accompanying dive issue. Also, it makes it lean forward, away from your body, which is particularly awkward.

[corduroyboy]

I've never see another Rick with the lug on the heel; Lemmy always did. Anyone ?

I did that to one of mine for a while. Pretty much because of Lemmy.

Its not a good idea, it makes the guitar seriously neck heavy with the accompanying dive issue. Also, it makes it lean forward, away from your body, which is particularly awkward.

Presumably it worked for Lemmy the better to play chords.

[Tache3]

Presumably it worked for Lemmy the better to play chords.

Maybe so. He obviously must have had some reason for preferring it that way. If I ever meet Tim Ellis again, I'll ask him.

[collin]

Finally, somebody suggested in my original thread that I replace the 73 jack plate with a 64; can anyone help with that please?

I disagree with this practice, it only leads to future confusion (and even deception) years down the line. Think years after we’re gone, this stuff will still be around.

Putting a ‘64 era jack plate on this 1999 doesn’t make it any more original. Unless it’s the jack plate from a confirmed RM1999 (which even then, is deceiving) I don’t see the point.

[corduroyboy]

Finally, somebody suggested in my original thread that I replace the 73 jack plate with a 64; can anyone help with that please?

I disagree with this practice, it only leads to future confusion (and even deception) years down the line. Think years after we’re gone, this stuff will still be around.

Putting a ‘64 era jack plate on this 1999 doesn’t make it any more original. Unless it’s the jack plate from a confirmed RM1999 (which even then, is deceiving) I don’t see the point.

Fair enough.
The bass is confusing to date (I had to insure it for a tour as a mix of 64 and 73); 'is it a 64 instrument with 73 modifications, or a 73 instrument as dated from the jack plate ?'

[teeder]

I'd much rather see a '64 plate on this bass than a '73.

[corduroyboy]

I'd much rather see a '64 plate on this bass than a '73.

Me too : )

[collin]

Finally, somebody suggested in my original thread that I replace the 73 jack plate with a 64; can anyone help with that please?

I disagree with this practice, it only leads to future confusion (and even deception) years down the line. Think years after we’re gone, this stuff will still be around.

Putting a ‘64 era jack plate on this 1999 doesn’t make it any more original. Unless it’s the jack plate from a confirmed RM1999 (which even then, is deceiving) I don’t see the point.

Fair enough.
The bass is confusing to date (I had to insure it for a tour as a mix of 64 and 73); 'is it a 64 instrument with 73 modifications, or a 73 instrument as dated from the jack plate ?'

I guess that's a philosophical question about what "makes" this object what it is (see "Ship of Theseus")

But since it's a functional bass without the jack plate, it's pretty straightforward to say that it's simply a '64 instrument with '73 modifications.

I'd much rather see a '64 plate on this bass than a '73.

Me three, but that's a lateral move at best. Still not the original plate. Might as well put a blank $3 Allparts jack plate on there, the rest of the bass can be dated by its construction.

[corduroyboy]

I an considering replacing with a blank plate - just not sure if that makes the dating more confusing.

I disagree with this practice, it only leads to future confusion (and even deception) years down the line. Think years after we’re gone, this stuff will still be around.

Putting a ‘64 era jack plate on this 1999 doesn’t make it any more original. Unless it’s the jack plate from a confirmed RM1999 (which even then, is deceiving) I don’t see the point.

Fair enough.
The bass is confusing to date (I had to insure it for a tour as a mix of 64 and 73); 'is it a 64 instrument with 73 modifications, or a 73 instrument as dated from the jack plate ?'

I guess that's a philosophical question about what "makes" this object what it is (see "Ship of Theseus")

But since it's a functional bass without the jack plate, it's pretty straightforward to say that it's simply a '64 instrument with '73 modifications.

I'd much rather see a '64 plate on this bass than a '73.

Me three, but that's a lateral move at best. Still not the original plate. Might as well put a blank $3 Allparts jack plate on there, the rest of the bass can be dated by its construction.

[henry5]

I always hated guitars with the strap button located on the heel; as has been said, they neck dive and hang away from you, which is horrendous for me. As a huge Lemmy fan I always wondered why he would do that, but I guess it must have worked for him.

BTW, good to see you’re still around here Richard. Saw Corduroy a couple of times in Blackpool back in the day; you were a great band and I loved your playing.

[corduroyboy]

Any knowledge on the scratch plate; painted white when I got the bass.

Looks copper (possibly brass), possibly to look like a Lemmy bass .. it's made well, not sharp edges or dodgy curves; everything lines up.

Ive seen plastic plates with copper backing and anodised brass Fender style plates...

Were Rickenbacker copper scratch plates a custom thing or standard at some point?

[bassduke49]

Certainly never a standard. Lots of users made/bought custom pickguards, some nifty, some, well, abominations. Standard Rickenbacker pick guards are plastic. Most are white, some more translucent (kinda see through) white, some black, and some (like the signature models) are back painted clear acrylic.

[collin]

The original pickguard for this RM1999 was made of 1/8" thick acrylic sheet in #7328 "sign white" color, which is medium translucent.

[pag]

Hello Corduroy!
Back in the summer of 1976 I went from Manchester to Rhodes Music on Denmark St to check out an RM1999. At the time these 60s basses cropped up from time to time in the for sale and music shop ads in the back of the Melody Maker and were practically always described as “60s dot neck Rickenbacker 4001 bass”. The one I saw in Rhodes Music in ‘76 was (as expected even back then) overpriced at around £300 if memory serves. (By comparison with London prices I bought Maurice Gibbs RM..I didn't know that at the time though!..for £275 from Honky Tonk Music in Essex in 1978 after knocking them down by 20 quid because it had no case!).
Anyway the FG RM at Rhodes was advertised as “Ex-Blackfoot Sue” who were a well known heavy rock band at the time. Frankly the poor RM looked like they had been digging the road with it! I tried it out and it played well but it had been abused to the point that it looked like it was going to fall apart. The point being that it might not have raised any interest from buyers back then and could well be the very same bass your friend picked up from a shop in the ‘70s. Who knows? Also theres footage of Mike Rutherfords RM showing some customisation on the pickup outputs with a jack on the pickguard..maybe he had another jack added to the body instead. Could it be that RM? Interesting bass you have there and great to see it in action for all these years!