Rickenbacker vs Fender (Side by Side)

[jack1953]

As I search for a Rick that would meet my budget, I was wanting to do, as best as possible, an apples to apples comparison between the Rick 4003 and the Fender Jazz bass. First of all, let me say that I don't know enough to know for sure that the Fender I've picked is the right one to compare. Fender may have another model that is closer, and I'll leave that up to you, the experts. I picked this Fender because it is a jazz and close to the 4003 in price.

http://bass-guitars.musiciansfriend.com ... sku=423730

For those of you who have played and/or owned both, can you give me a side by side, or if there's a model closer than by all means use the best apples to apples you can come up with. Thanks.

Jack

[ricosound]

Common opinion is that the P-bass is closer in tone to the Rick. I have a mid 90's ash bodied Fender P/J Special and it sounds more classic Rick than my 4001! A Jazz can give you the Fender Growl that they are known for but it is not particularly Rick-ish clanky. I'm sure like all opinions I will be disputed, but to my ears in my experience that's the nutshell.

[jack1953]

Common opinion is that the P-bass is closer in tone to the Rick. I have a mid 90's ash bodied Fender P/J Special and it sounds more classic Rick than my 4001! A Jazz can give you the Fender Growl that they are known for but it is not particularly Rick-ish clanky. I'm sure like all opinions I will be disputed, but to my ears in my experience that's the nutshell.

Okay rico, so you've owned the P and the Fender and you've compared the sound. What about, in your opinion, the quality, playability, features, and best bang for the buck type comparison?

Jack

[gearhed289]

I personally think a Jazz Bass can be very similar in tone to a Ric. Rush's Moving Pictures album is a perfect example. It's mostly Jazz, with a couple of songs done on the Ric. And they sound REALLY similar. Obviously a player's particular attack has a lot to do with it. I think they compliment each other nicely. I've just found it really hard to find a Fender I really like. You have to play a LOT of them to find one good one. They're a bit more "cave man" than a Ric (no offense to cave men!). Rics seem to be a lot more consistent in quality and playability. The Jazz Bass you linked to has an active circuit, so you can't really compare it to a Ric. Go with an American Standard for a real A/B test.

[rickenbrother]

Sometimes I think a Rick gets a tone close to a P-bass, sometimes I think it gets a toner closer to the J-bass. Actually it's a matter of playing technique, rig, eq and other gear.
One very important thing to keep in mind when comparing a J-bass to a Rick, is the feel of the neck. The J-bass has much more taper to the neck (skinny on top, wide at the bottom), than a Rick which has little taper in comparison. The P-bass has less taper than a J-bass, closer to the Rick neck taper.
Some players, especially me, hate the accentuated taper of a J-bass neck. Some love it for how thin it is on top.

[AdamBomb]

I play an American Fender Jazz from the early 90's through an Ampeg SVT II and 8x10, and am actually looking at purchasing my first Rickenbacker right now, so although I can't compare them too accurately, I can attest to there being something really tough and primal about the Fender sound and feel as opposed to how pretty and singy the Ric seems to me. The neck on my Fender is thicker then all of the Rics that I've tried, also there's a roundness to the Fender fretboard as opposed to the Rickenbacker's flat fretboard, which I've heard makes Rics a bit easier and smoother to play, but I can't legitimize the accuracy of that at this point. Ultimately, although I'm branching out, I can't imagine selling my Fender Jazz. For all the times it feels like such a stock tone to me, I still come back to it all the time and am really impressed with how rich it is, both onstage and in the recording studio. Hope this helps in some way, you're in a very similar position as myself, as I think I may end up with a new 4003 if I don't pick up something vintage.

[rickaddict]

I agree with Joey. I had a very nice Custom Shop '64 RI Jazz. I hated how the strings were so far apart at the bridge and so close together at the nut. I mean...I'm sure you get used to it...I'm just used to my Ricks.

Other considerations are...Are you a large or small guy? I'm relatively small at 5'8". Rick 4001/4003's have a slightly smaller scale which is easier for me to navigate. Ricks are also not as long from the tip of the headstock to the bridge strap peg. And I personally prefer a smaller overall instrument.

If balance is important, the Rick gets the nod there too. A 4001/4003 sits on your leg more comfortably and balances better than a Jazz.

[paul_yan]

+1

I also love the 33 1/4" scale length for its more springy/lively sound.

[FretlessOnly]

Let's get something clear: I love my '97 CIJ Fender Jazz FL, but I wouldn't even consider buying a new American Jazz for ~$100-$200 less than a new 4003. As for tonal comparison, here are my thoughts:

2008 4003 FL - Dominant: mid growl; second: low punch; third: crisp highs, all three voicings are distinctly presented;

1997 Jazz FL - Dominant: low-mid growl; second: low thump; third: clear highs, all three voicings are there, but not as distinct from one another;

1976 Precision FL - Dominant: low-mid boom; second: mid punch; third: see blend of dominant and secondary - there is one sound coming from the P-bass, not distinct voicings.

These are my impressions of what I hear from mine. At one time or another I've had La Bella Deep Talkin' Flats on each of these, so that is what my comments are based on. I have different strings on them at this point.

My biggest gripe about the Rick is the lack of a thumb anchor above the neck pickup.

[sloop_john_b]

My biggest gripe about the Rick is the lack of a thumb anchor above the neck pickup.

it's called the edge of the pickguard; my thumb has been there for years.

[jack1953]

Okay ....... bottom line: You have 2000 dollars to spend. You can only get a Rickenbacker or a Fender. Which one would you choose, assuming you wanted to get the best bang for the buck?

[sloop_john_b]

For $2000 you can get a sweet used 4003 and a MIM or MIJ Fender that will be equally as good (if not better) as a $1500 Fender.

[rickenbrother]

+1

I also love the 33 1/4" scale length for its more springy/lively sound.

The 33 1/4" scale is also easier on the hand. I have a 5 string bass guitar with a 35" scale, which is supposed to make the B string better. That's debatable, but anyway, my hand gets tired on that bass unlike any other after a while and I'm positive the 35" scale is the reason why.

[ajish4]

For $2000 you can get a sweet used 4003 and a MIM or MIJ Fender that will be equally as good (if not better) as a $1500 Fender.

You all may laugh, but I liked this better than any NEW Fender I've tried...and for PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR!

http://www.squierguitars.com/products/s ... 0326702521

I'm NOT comparing this to a VINTAGE JAZZ....but it equals most new stuff they make today!

[antipodean]

The J-bass world is so diverse... The Deluxe that you have picked as an example would appear to be Fender's response to the "super-J Basses" such as Sadowsky, Lakland, Lull and Atelier-Z (and many more...) that feature up-graded pickups (often noisless) and active eq and top-class craftsmanship. The bass will be extremely versatile in terms of tone. The '70s style neck may be even more tapered than the standard J-bass (which has a neck profile more akin to an early/mid '60s J-bass), but a little "deeper" or more U-shaped than C-shaped - ie narrower at the nut but thicker front to back.

I find passive J-basses to be wonderfully versatile - active J-basses can pretty much take on any tone you are after provided the pre-amp is top-notch. I find both neck profiles comfortable, but they're not everyone's cup of tea - as Joey attests.

Now for the fun part - you can get the J-bass experience by lobbing in a second hand MIJ or US standard for way under the price of the Deluxe. In general Fenders are very robust but the slender neck of the J-bass can suffer under heavy abuse, so a little caution is required, but you can get one in excellent condition for around USD700, including shipping (this is from a top-flight dealer in Tokyo - so the risk on condition is pretty much nil). I have also heard great things about the MIM J-basses as well as some of the Squiers, but QC in Japan and the US is just that little more consistent.

You'll note that at this price point you will not be able to find a 4001/3 unless it has serious issues. So the comparison is not strictly apples/apples.

Now to be subjective - amongst several basses I own a '74 4001 and a MIJ '62 J-bass (fitted with upgraded pups). The 4001 is a work of art that is a joy to play. The J-bass is a great tool that I'm not afraid to abuse. In terms of tone, they're both very versatile. The J-bass is utilitarian, the Rick is "special". I'm not sure if that helps....

Biggest point, if I haven't already made it clear, is that at around $1,500, a new Deluxe J-bass is not great value. The marginal gain over it's more lowly bretheren is minimal, and value retention is poor as these things are produced in healthy numbers. If you're spending in the region of $1.5k - 2k, the Rick will hold its value better and be a rewarding instrument to play.

The third option is that $2k will get you a great used MIJ J-bass and a cool rig....