Possible 12 string design upgrades

[cmuk]

I'm fairly sure that some older 12-string, 6-saddle brings had a compensated saddle on either the D or G pair. Didn't Harrison's have this? Can anyone verify?

If the compensated saddles were available as separate components, perhaps you could tweak your bridge set-up to get the best of both worlds?

[IHeartRics]

My 330/12 seems to be fine with the 6 saddle bridge. The only time I recall having an issue was when I broke the G octive string right before a gig and just replaced it with a single stray string from a music store. I think it's guage was slightly different - can't remember as I was in a hurry and it was some time ago. It worked for the night but it was never quite right. I restrung it with a new set and all was well. Makes me wonder how critical the tolerance is within a set and what each manufacturer's tolerances are. Maybe switching to a different brand might help some people? Who knows.

As for re-stringing with the R tail peice, I do it similar to Paul's method and it seems to do the trick.

[akhv]

To those who has intonation problems on 12strings - I wonder how big is intonation deviation on your guitars? On my 370/12 intonation isn't absolutely perfect but stays within 2 or 3 cents on the part of the neck near the body, and less on the rest of the neck (and to me that's definetly not a problem).

[brian_l]

The biggest design upgrade that Rickenbacker could do on a 12 string instrument is to make the neck wider. I know that the 660 has the wider neck, but I would like to see ALL Rick 12 strings available with a wider neck. Some of us don't want a 660. We would LOVE to get a 330 or 360 but with a wider neck to accommodate those of us with larger hands.

[xpitt]

The biggest design upgrade that Rickenbacker could do on a 12 string instrument is to make the neck wider. I know that the 660 has the wider neck, but I would like to see ALL Rick 12 strings available with a wider neck. Some of us don't want a 660. We would LOVE to get a 330 or 360 but with a wider neck to accommodate those of us with larger hands.

Yes

[scoobster28]

I think I saw a picture of a 360 style guitar with a wider neck. I am sure I have seen them, actually, but I mean one that came from the factory like that. Perhaps an experiment, or a custom order, or something.

[whojamfan]

My 330/12 seems to be fine with the 6 saddle bridge. The only time I recall having an issue was when I broke the G octive string right before a gig and just replaced it with a single stray string from a music store. I think it's guage was slightly different - can't remember as I was in a hurry and it was some time ago. It worked for the night but it was never quite right. I restrung it with a new set and all was well. Makes me wonder how critical the tolerance is within a set and what each manufacturer's tolerances are. Maybe switching to a different brand might help some people? Who knows.

As for re-stringing with the R tail peice, I do it similar to Paul's method and it seems to do the trick.

Mine doesn't intonate well with a standard RIC 12 set, but does just fine with the TI Flat set from POTR.

[JakeK]

Intonation on my V64's 6-saddle is fine with the TI flats or the Curt Mangan roundwounds.

[jimk]

My 360/12 does fine with either RIC or Curt Mangan strings + factory 6 saddle bridge.
JimK

[Folkie]

I have my 330/12 strung with D'Addario EXL 150's (.010 to .046), and I have had some intonation problems higher up on the neck on the G-pair, but not enough to contemplate making a major modification to the guitar. I just replaced the low string on the G-pair (an unwound .017) with a wound .020, and this has helped the intonation problems a little. For the record, I just tried a new fireglo 360/12 from off the wall at Sam Ash, and it had the same intonation problems as mine.

[vynesmusic]

If you want to talk about improvements, a tailpiece that doesn't make you wish you had 3 arms to string up would be nice.

Aka "third hand"

Yesssss........The TRUE Musicians' Friend....duct tape.....that's how I re-string....

[jingle_jangle]

So...do those "tapewounds" stay in tune? Mine sound flabby...

[drumbob]

The biggest gripe I have is the narrow neck on my 330-12. I don't understand why they don't put the wider 660 neck on all the 12-strings. I love the 330 otherwise, and would have to sell it to buy a 660, which I frankly don't want to do. I wish I could play a proper Asus chord, but I can't.

Next, for heaven's sake, just put the 12 saddle bridge on all the 12s as standard equipment instead of making us have to buy them as an add-on.

I too have had conversations with Chris at POTR and he said the same thing; just play the damn guitar and don't worry about the low E's being a little flat. Think of all the great records made with the guitar in that condition.

In a crowded bar with people more concerned with scoring some action, no one is going to say, "Your low E strings sound flat."

[fluffy]

If you want to talk about improvements, a tailpiece that doesn't make you wish you had 3 arms to string up would be nice.

Aka "third hand"

Ladies and gentlemen, Red Green on restringing Rickenbackers
Ahh, the never ending uses for duct tape............

I'm a Man
I can change (the strings on my 360/12)
If I have to
I guess

[buchrob]

If you ever wanted to frustrate a fellow musician long after you're dead and gone, just leave him a 325/12 with a Bigsby in your will with the proviso that the strings have to be changed every month and played in tune to your executor.

But to get serious: I sold, for financial reasons, a 330-12 with toasters at one point a few years ago, acquired a Dean Boca 12-string for $350 as an interim measure/plaything and switched the string/nut/bridge around to match the Ric set-up, and the result was about 90% there at relatively little cost. The neck and bridge match the wider dimensions of the 660 almost exactly.

Well, I wasn't happy with 90%, so I waited for the right 660/12 to come along, not being a fan of tiger-striped wood on my guitars. Now I do have the right one in hand and I can make the following observations:

1. The 12-string Ric saddle gives you more accurate intonaton, but actually at the expense of the 3xx/12 sound. Part of the charm of the older models is that they are just a little out of tune, but not seriously so, at some point on the fret board. BUT, you do have better control over intonation with the 12-saddle design, and don't have to accept things as just the way it is...

2. Part of the "jangle" is that instead of hearing 6-strings in perfect harmony doubled by their octaves or paired strings, you are actually hearing 12 slightly different strings, brought about by the fact that a double-bridge can't intonate perfectly. You can actually increase the "jangle" effect by playing with slightly different string gauges on the same course, such as one 10 and and one 11 for the high E string pair.

I can live with my Boca, but prefer the 660/12. If I were to suggest a new model to Ric, it would be a 650 (wider neck)/12 with 12-saddle. It would certainly ingite a lot more interest in the 650 line, which has long been an underdog, but better priced to compete with the Fender MIA offerings.