'66 Tailpiece Bracket Issue

[C'sPop]

Greetings all,

New member/first post, so my apologies if this isn't the appropriate forum. I have a question regarding proper mounting/support of the "R" tailpiece bracket and couldn't find anything specific to my issue in forum searches.

I have a 1966 360/12 that was recently, and nicely, pro refinished (a rescue from an earlier paint job somewhere back in time). I asked for a refin; got back a restoration ...very happy! However, the strap buttons were not original and do not support the tailpiece bracket.

My question is two-fold:

1. Does the strap button help attach and support the bracket and should the bracket then be flush with the bottom edge of the body, or rest on the front surface? With just the two small wood screws holding the bracket in place, it is lifted from the edge and is resting on the front.

2. I know the factory buttons use machine screws of larger OD than the aftermarket Schallers, but were the original '66 button screws a larger diameter than even current Rick, or was there an insert to accept the screw? The hole in the body that accepts the bottom strap button is larger than the factory screw from my '80 4001 (fits very loosely) and shows only very light scoring artifacts from thread engagement, much lighter than I'd expect even from a machine thread. It appears to be very close in diameter to corresponding hole in the bracket (there's also some thread scoring on the bracket as if at one time a similar sized screw was in place).

Given that even the factory 4001 screws are too small, I'm assuming ordering the strap button from the RIC shop won't help me (won't even stay in place for that matter). As this is a player, I'd like to use strap locks but, at this point, I'm more concerned about sufficient support for the tailpiece.

If this is the result of some modification made by a previous owner and my only recourse is to dowel with hardwood and re-drill, so be it. I can follow recommendations provided elsewhere in this forum. If, however, something different was done in '66 that I'm not aware of (and I know they didn't ask me!), I'd hate to do the wrong fix for the right problem. This is my second Rick 12 but my 620 is long gone, along with memory of sufficient detail, so I could really use any reference info.

In summary, (and I just realized I not-so-subtly asked one question and then expanded to 4!):

1. Is tailpiece bracket supposed to be flush with bottom edge and raised off the face of the guitar with the strap button properly attached and tightened, therefore, providing the bulk of the strength?

2. Is the dimension of the lower strap button hole on a 1966 larger than even the current Ricks, or would they have used an insert at that time?

3. Would filling with a hardwood dowel then drilling to accept a RIC screw be the appropriate fix, or is there a better option?

4. What is the average annual rainfall of the Amazon basin, …in angstroms? (this one's less urgent)

Any help/info/advice would be greatly appreciated. After years inappropriately attired, it's now a gorgeous Jetglo and dying to be played, but I'm a little concerned about the stress on the retaining screws ...and consequently on my nerves!

Thanks. Cheers!

[tmossman]

4. What is the average annual rainfall of the Amazon basin, …in angstroms?

That's easy 20,320,000,000 angstroms.

I'll let the others cover 1-3.

[jingle_jangle]

1. Is tailpiece bracket supposed to be flush with bottom edge and raised off the face of the guitar with the strap button properly attached and tightened, therefore, providing the bulk of the strength?

Is the tailpiece bracket a replacement? There are at least two different patterns involving the location of the strap button with relation to the vertical centerline of the guitar. The bracket should be slightly up from the bottom edge (this can vary on older Ricks like yours) and the two hooks can be either resting on the top surface or slightly raised, again, depending on individual guitar fits. More important is whether the hole for the strap button lines up with the hole in the guitar for same.

2. Is the dimension of the lower strap button hole on a 1966 larger than even the current Ricks, or would they have used an insert at that time?

No insert was used--the maple was threaded to accept the 10-24 machine screw, which it what's always been used (to my knowledge and experience).

3. Would filling with a hardwood dowel then drilling to accept a RIC screw be the appropriate fix, or is there a better option?

It's a good option. Try using a maple dowel if you can find it; birch dowels are sometimes soft.

Best option is a brass threaded insert, glued into an oversized hole in the wood. Use gap-filling super glue. Strap button screws into the brass insert.

4. What is the average annual rainfall of the Amazon basin, …in angstroms? (this one's less urgent)

Any help/info/advice would be greatly appreciated. After years inappropriately attired, it's now a gorgeous Jetglo and dying to be played, but I'm a little concerned about the stress on the retaining screws ...and consequently on my nerves!

Thanks. Cheers!

[C'sPop]

Thanks Todd!
Man, that's still 14 over my max limit. Looks like I canoe the Huron again this year instead. D..n!

Paul,
Thanks for your comments. I don't believe the bracket is a replacement. Finish quality is consistant with the rest of the hardware but, to be honest, I'm not sure I'd know the difference with any certainty. (attempting to post pic. ...a 50/50 chance for success!)

Hole is definitely larger than 10-24 so it must have had a larger screw at one point, then replaced with the long thin wood screw that was there when I bought it. Looks like I need to consider your minor in-patient surgery options.

Hole alignment appears to be okay so, per your comment, I assume position is probably original and correct. If it's okay for the hook to rest on the face then I probably shouldn't be overly concerned ...just seemed like an odd angle on the bracket retaining screws, which gave me visions of 12 string tension flinging the tailpiece across the room at some point.. After looking closer, I guess the strap bolt won't really raise the hook off the face by much if at all, but will help relieve stress on the screws.

Thanks again for your help. Very much appreciated. I suspected this outcome, but didn't want to destroy that rare little-known vintage '60's 'floating strap button' system out of pure ignorance.

Now to just get up the nerve to drill ...

[jingle_jangle]

For some reason, I was picturing a trapeze and bracket in my mind's eye. So my comments regarding different types should be disregarded.

Anyway, a brass threaded insert is your answer, as drilling and dowelling would leave you with too little meat for the threads to work reliably for very long under that stress.