24fret vs 21fret

[ricmic]

Just wondering why RIC made the change from 24 frets to 21 frets on their 350 models. I would love to have a 24 fret 350. Just curious. Mark

[jdogric12]

maybe to make them more like vintage 325's?

[ricmic]

Bro, that does make some sense. Did all of the "guitar" line at that time change or just the 350? Mark

[sloop_john_b]

The 330 and 360 changed from 21 to 24 frets in the early to mid 70's.

The 350 was originally 24 frets (circa 1984), and changed to 21 frets in the early 90's.

[ricmic]

Is the 330 and 360 still 24 fret? Mark

[ricmic]

Answered my own dumb question by going to the RIC forum and looking under "models". DUH. Just not to bright at times. Mark

[ricmic]

Does anybody know why the 350 was changed from 24 frets to 21 frets? Mark

[sloop_john_b]

Does anybody know why the 350 was changed from 24 frets to 21 frets? Mark

Probably to make it more of a "vintage spec" instrument. When the number of frets changed, the model name also changed - to 350v63.

[Rickissippi]

I love my modern 360, but sometimes I wish it were a 21-fret axe. I hardly ever use those super high frets, and isn't the tonal advantage of fewer frets two-fold, (1) more spread between the two pickups, and (2) better neck p'up position (directly under the harmonic)?

I thought it was so cool to have a 24-fret PRS when I first bought that guitar (long since sold), but the one time I would hit that high E during a gig probably wasn't worth it.

[iiipopes]

Actually, having the pickup under the "harmonic" of the 24th fret is the worst place to have a pickup, as the nodes cut out primary overtones on open strings, and still truncate them as a player comes up the neck making the entire guitar "hollow" sounding in the neck position. Yes, there are some jazz players who prefer this, and on such instruments as Fender Strats where there is also a 3rd pickup there is a use for it. The best place, to get even harmonic development and still be mellow, is to have the polepieces under a spot, depending on your flavor, from anywhere from where the 25th to the 30th fret. Now, keep everything civil for this next reference: Ed Roman blows hard on a lot of topics, but on this one he is correct. Years before I knew the math, I liked the tone of the neck pickup of my Sears $56 special better than my expensive Les Paul I had in high school, because the Sears guitar had the neck pickup about where Ed talks about it should be, and the Gibson, of course, had the neck pickup in the hole where most are. Now, frankly, I don't think this was much of a consideration when RIC changed from a 21 fret to a 24 fret neck, but I've played both, I own both (320 & 360-12WB) and they both have their unique personalities I wouldn't trade either for. Any time I have an instrument I can modify, one of the things I modify is the placement of the neck pickup closer to the bridge. I find it helps the pickups blend better in the middle position, that even though a slight bit of contrast is given away between neck & bridge pickups, the transition between them is so much smoother, and I can eq and slot the mix better going from selector swith position to position. Personally, I actually prefer a position about half way between the 24th fret and what Ed Roman says is "optimal" for a 6-string, but he's right on for versatility of a 12-string, including RIC 24 fret instruments. In addition to all the jangle, I find in that position that, being close to the standard position of an acoustic soundhole (coincidence? I think NOT), I can eq to get a very acoustic-y tone when hard jangle may not be the most suitable tone for a particular song. This just shows how much more versatile a properly set up RIC instrument is than the popular press gives credit.

http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/scalelength.htm

[LenMinNJ]

You might have a look at this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=402127

[Hotzenplotz]

Is the 330 and 360 still 24 fret? Mark

Yes:
http://www.rickenbacker.com/model.asp?model=330
http://www.rickenbacker.com/model.asp?model=360

[stsang]

Actually, having the pickup under the "harmonic" of the 24th fret is the worst place to have a pickup, as the nodes cut out primary overtones on open strings, and still truncate them as a player comes up the neck making the entire guitar "hollow" sounding in the neck position. Yes, there are some jazz players who prefer this, and on such instruments as Fender Strats where there is also a 3rd pickup there is a use for it. The best place, to get even harmonic development and still be mellow, is to have the polepieces under a spot, depending on your flavor, from anywhere from where the 25th to the 30th fret. Now, keep everything civil for this next reference: Ed Roman blows hard on a lot of topics, but on this one he is correct. Years before I knew the math, I liked the tone of the neck pickup of my Sears $56 special better than my expensive Les Paul I had in high school, because the Sears guitar had the neck pickup about where Ed talks about it should be, and the Gibson, of course, had the neck pickup in the hole where most are. Now, frankly, I don't think this was much of a consideration when RIC changed from a 21 fret to a 24 fret neck, but I've played both, I own both (320 & 360-12WB) and they both have their unique personalities I wouldn't trade either for. Any time I have an instrument I can modify, one of the things I modify is the placement of the neck pickup closer to the bridge. I find it helps the pickups blend better in the middle position, that even though a slight bit of contrast is given away between neck & bridge pickups, the transition between them is so much smoother, and I can eq and slot the mix better going from selector swith position to position. Personally, I actually prefer a position about half way between the 24th fret and what Ed Roman says is "optimal" for a 6-string, but he's right on for versatility of a 12-string, including RIC 24 fret instruments. In addition to all the jangle, I find in that position that, being close to the standard position of an acoustic soundhole (coincidence? I think NOT), I can eq to get a very acoustic-y tone when hard jangle may not be the most suitable tone for a particular song. This just shows how much more versatile a properly set up RIC instrument is than the popular press gives credit.

Scott - thanks for that explanation! Very interesting and insightful. (one more reason to love my 24-fret 360/12 )

[iiipopes]

Scott - thanks for that explanation! Very interesting and insightful. (one more reason to love my 24-fret 360/12 )

My pleasure. You're welcome.