My New 4001C64 - Questions, please

admin · Post by **admin** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:40 am

Doug: thanks for the photos. A picture is worth more than a thousand words. In this case it is worth the solution to your problem. Please send us in the new photos after you have made your adjustments.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat May 31, 2003 5:11 am

This is what the action should be ...

http://www.3dentourage.com/90-blue.htm

bottom4 · Post by **bottom4** » Sat May 31, 2003 6:10 am

Hey Jeff, That’s one beautiful Rick!

Cheers!

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:15 pm

ok, i removed the bridge mechanism and adjusted the screws, but they still extend beyond the bridge as you can see in this picture (i cannot get the screws to go further into the bridge, unless perhaps I really crank them down really really hard, which I am hesitant to do):

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:17 pm

and so the screws still seem to be preventing the bridge from lowering all the way (thus keeping me from lowering the string action further):

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:24 pm

let me reiterate, that i really like the sound of this bass, and I love the way the neck feels in my hands... i think this bass is a keeper, once I get this problem solved

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Sat May 31, 2003 3:43 pm

Someone has apparently changed the screws out for bigger screws(which would require each saddle to be accordingly drilled and tapped). This is why the head protrudes from the bridge that way without fitting all the way into the countersunk area for the screw head. This is actually part of what I do to the bridge when I make my bridge/tailpiece modification. Try this...get a Dremmel tool with appropriate bit and grind the slot (on the opposite end of the screw in the tailpiece behind the mute)deeper being carefull to keep the same lower countour it already has. Now flip the bridge around. You now have clearence to lower it more and the screws are easier to adjust for intonation. Be sure to reverse the saddles to go in their old positions.

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sat May 31, 2003 4:17 pm

thanks, Dane... the bass was bought new, I am surprised to see this... would love to hear from any other 4001C64 owners to see if my problem is unique for some reason

gpatt5762 · Post by **gpatt5762** » Sat May 31, 2003 5:02 pm

Doug, You are going about this ALL WRONG!!

It's the strings themselves. Roundwounds have higher tension, which in turn pulls the neck up.

Just install PYRAMIDS on the bass and watch your problems disappear. BTW, I had no such issues with my MG C64. It was ready to play, and in perfect tune right out of the case. And yes, my action and playaybility improved with Pyramids, which exert less tension on the neck, and consequently, the truss rods.

The bass sounds that much better with flats anyway.

Good Luck, (and don't void your warranty fiddling with the bridge)
Garry

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:12 pm

Garry, yoou're not helping matters with your opinion on round wounds and assessment as them being the problem. There is definitely something up with this bridge if the intonation screws wont seat all the way alowing action to be lowered. The neck is probably not "pulling up" unless it needs adjustment. RIC changed the model name from 4001 to 4003 to a make a clean distinction between the two probably because of the earlier truss rod design. Rounds don't sound like flats so why should he change them? I have rounds and flats on my Rickys and not only do my necks not pull up, they are the old truss rod design. Incidently, for a given gauge and material, flats have about 5% more tension than rounds. So lets be constructive and solve Doug's problem.

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Sat May 31, 2003 9:29 pm

Doug, I had a thought. Perhaps when the bridge was assembled at the factory, they inserted the intonation screws from the wrong side. Looking at the side opposite the screw heads, is it countersunk? Does the side with the heads have un-countersunk holes? Since you're the first owner this certainly sound possible. Post a pic of the side opposite the screw heads.

paul_yan · Post by **paul_yan** » Sat May 31, 2003 10:07 pm

Doug,

Do as Dane suggested.

And try this before resorting to a Dremel:

1-Adjust the neck relief to your liking. (Press the 1st and last frets simultaneously and a gap no larger than one or two business cards should exist between the strings and the 8th fret. Do this for both sides of the neck, i.e. the E and G strings.) When done,loosen the strings until you can carefully take the bridge off the tailpiece.
2-Make a simple drawing of the current saddle locations. You might also want to mark the undersides of the saddles with the letters EADG in case you mess up and forget which saddle is for which string.
3-Loosen the intonation screws until they can be removed from the bridge.
4-Hold your saddles at the other end of the bridge and tighten the screws, with a little pressing force so they keep to the bridge, until they grab the hole at the other side and that the saddles can be pulled towards the end strap bolt if you turn the screws clockwise., then stop. You don't want them in their proper position yet.
The screw heads should not protrude like in your picture at this time.
5-Put the bridge back into the tailpiece. Make sure its front wall "kisses" the back wall of the mute pad fortress. Or at least, its black height adj. screws should stand 90 degrees to the tailpiece.
6-With a tuner, tune the bass to pitch, check your desired neck relief again first, then the bridge height to taste. (You should be able to lower the bridge at your will since the screw heads do not protrude.) IMPORTANT: Neck relief and (then) string action are always to be adjusted before intonation.
7-With all strings tuned right in open notes, they should be sharp at the 12th fret as the saddles are closest to the neck now. Turn the saddle screws clockwise a little at a time (with that string loosened enough to allow saddle travels) until intonation is right. Proceed to intonate all 4 strings. I'd leave the intonation a bit sharp for now and come back to do more clockwise turning for the final adjustment tomorrow as the neck may need 12 hours to totally settle.

It's easy to make the screws back off like yours turning them counterclockwise. So always start a setup where you only turn them clockwise to get your intonation.

One extra measure you can take is to insert a thin steel wire across between the screws and the bottom of the bridgepiece to "grab" them in place like some Gibson guitars' Tune-O-matic bridges.

Keep us posted how the operation turns out.

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 2:48 am

(thanks everyone for your input!)

Dane - I thought about the bridge being inadvertently reversed, but you can see from the pics that the screw holes are countersunk about the same on both sides (perhaps a little bit more on the side the heads are currently in):

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 2:49 am

dougl · Post by **dougl** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 2:52 am

let me say again that there is very little relief in the neck -- oh, and for what its worth, I do use flatwounds as a general rule on my other bass (fender precision), and I may yet use flats on this bass, but right now I really like the sound of the stock rounds!