Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

Clint wrote:Oh God, the Hondo II. Was there ever, ever a worse guitar?

It takes 1st prize; awful guitar. When I was in school, it seemed like every guitar player I knew had one. I'd bring my 4001 to a jam, we'd start setting up, and I'd see a guy take what I thought was a LP out of its case, only to be disappointed every time when I looked at the headstock and it said "HONDO II". this was usuallyfollowed by a request to jam on some gawdawful stuff I had no interest in playing. . . after enough repetitions of that experience, even the sight of a real LP put a bad taste in my mouth, which lingers somewhat to this day! (I must admit to a fondness for the white LP Custom though)


Anyway, Tom, I still suggest the Gretsch first, unless you're going for those sophisticated out of phase sounds that a Strat can produce with the five way switch combo, which do come across nicely in a recording. You already have a solid body in the SG, and a thinline with your 360, but you do not have a full hollowbody electric, which the Gretsch is. The three way switch combo and individual p/up volumes, tone control, and master volume, make for a versatile guitar live or in the studio.

Since you're coming to SCARF, I can bring my 6120, and one of my Strats to try out, if you like, so you can decide for yourself which you prefer. . . . that is if I'm not beaten senseless with Rick instruments by some of the other members for showing up with a Strat and a Gretsch . . . .

Tom, just buy a Strat and save your pennies for a vintage Gretsch a bit later on.

I would go for a Mexican-made Standard Strat - they're better sounding and playing than the USA models, IMO. I've compared numerous examples back-to-back, and I would recommend you do too if you decide to go the Strat route.

Spend the difference on some '57/'62 pickups and you're ready to rock!

This is great. I figured I'd get a couple of responses and not the range of opinions that have been posted.
I have played a number of Strats over the years, 5 minutes here, 10 minutes there. I know that Fender guitars are iconic instruments and all, but I'm starting to lean towards starting with a Gretsch and picking up a Strat/Tele later. I also need to check out the Tele and see if that might be a better option than the Strat. My aim is to build a small stable of very playable guitars that can cover a large tone spectrum (for recording) and not break the bank doing so. Anyway, thanks to all for the advice. Seems like there are dedicated fans of both companies.
Tom
Paul, I appreciate the offer to bring those non-Rick guitars to SCARF. Actually, I'd mostly want to check out a well set-up, modded 5120, but you didn't mention having or bringing one. The 6120 would be interesting to try, but it's outside my price range.

Nice to hear, Tom. Glad you're finding all of the responses helpful. I like your plan... come to think of it, I've followed a similar one over the years.

I think the 6120 and 5120 have very similar body and neck dimensions, IIRC. The difference is the 5120 is made in South Korea instead of The Terada factory in Japan, of course, and the pickups aren't as high quality. I suggested bringing my 6120 because I thought playing it would give you a fair representation of how your 5120 would play and sound after you modded it with some replacement pickups.

After working for a few Fender dealers, including a very high end "Diamond" dealer,it has been my experience that there is so much fluctuation in the instruments, that it is hard to really know if you are getting a good one, or just one that was better than the other 10 in the store. Most diehard Fender players I have encountered all have a similar story about going through numerous makes and manufacturing facilities before finding their sweetheart piece. Country of manufacture and model line can really cross boundries, and they have found 200 dollar ones they liked better than 1200 dollar ones. Once they did find it, they will never give it up and can't praise it enough. Having played even consecutive serial# instruments straight out of the box, I have noticed sometimes drastic differences.
So, what does this all mean?
I would say get the Gretsch, only because you tighter tolerance of how the instrument plays and feels without scouring the earth. When you come across that Fender that really knocks your socks off, you'll be glad you waited, as you'll now have a proper representation of that instrument, rather than an ok one you hope dressing up will improve.
Just 2cents from a guy who spent many years trying to dress up mediocre instruments in the hopes that they would become stellar. I have an ok MIM Strat I bought years ago just to have that sound in my arsenal, dropped hundreds of dollars of upgrades on it, and now it is an ok guitar with some nice pickups and hardware on it. Works for me, but I don't really play it that often, but probably would if it was a killer guitar.
Paul, you're welcome to use my White Les Paul Custom anytime I guarantee the Hondo nightmares will be a thing of the past
Hope this helps.

whojamfan wrote:After working for a few Fender dealers, including a very high end "Diamond" dealer,it has been my experience that there is so much fluctuation in the instruments, that it is hard to really know if you are getting a good one, or just one that was better than the other 10 in the store. Most diehard Fender players I have encountered all have a similar story about going through numerous makes and manufacturing facilities before finding their sweetheart piece.
Hope this helps.

Without incurring the wrath of all of the Fender fans here, I have to say that I haven't ever played a Fender guitar that felt good. For want of a better description, the frets/fingerboard seem to 'bite' my fingers. After a very short time, I didn't want to play it anymore (tired). By contrast, I've never played a Gibson where this happened. I'm talking about instruments made in the USA prior to about 1985, before the rampant outsourcing.

The reason I put a Strat as an option for a new guitar is that the Fender sound is iconic and something that I want to have available and also I figure that I may have just never run into a 'sweetheart' guitar in the past. A Fender would have to play nearly as easily as my SG before I'd be happy with it. Anyone else notice this frets/fingerboard thing or did I just run into a lot of bad setups? Tom

It may be down to the size of and how Fender dresses their frets.

beatbyrd wrote:Without incurring the wrath of all of the Fender fans here, I have to say that I haven't ever played a Fender guitar that felt good. For want of a better description, the frets/fingerboard seem to 'bite' my fingers. After a very short time, I didn't want to play it anymore (tired).

While I love Strats, I think you just answered your own question. Get the Gretsch.

Tom: After reading your posts I suspect that you will be happiest with a Gretsch at this stage of your playing career. I would go with a 5120 and modify it to suit your needs. These guitars are put together well but I believe I am on safe ground in saying that you will not be happy with the stock pickups. You may be able to live with the rest of the guitar. Time to play a number in your local music shops. My suggestion is that you get a used 5120 in good shape and build from there. Take the ferry in separate affordable trips rather than emabarking on a bridge too far. Your digital recorder won't mind the appearance one bit and you will have great fun on this journey.

Tom you should look into warmouth if you want to build your own. They make strat bodies and necks, but be careful they make several different neck cuts so you have to chose the right one that fits your hand best. Body high end is six hundred dollars with finish ready to wire. Neck high end is four hundred dollars with finish.Total so far 1000 dollars less the hardware. Machine heads, trem bar, neck plate, springs, spring claw, string trees, and pickup choice, three pots, jack plate, pickguard and switch. They make excellent products. Here is a picture of one I'm working on. You will not find this quality on any entry level American Standard in this price range. Here is the link to the website. But should you decide to go with the gretsch 5120 that to is a great choice.

http://www.warmoth.com/ -

Why would you ask us which guitar is right for you? You're going to get a couple dozen opinions, some valid, some not. Strats and Gretsches are fundamentally different animals. Assess the music you play and which guitar sounds are better for that purpose. Go with your gut; play a bunch of guitars and see what works for you...not us.

drumbob wrote:Why would you ask us which guitar is right for you? You're going to get a couple dozen opinions, some valid, some not. Strats and Gretsches are fundamentally different animals. Assess the music you play and which guitar sounds are better for that purpose. Go with your gut; play a bunch of guitars and see what works for you...not us.

Valid question. The thing is, I'm pretty much a bass player. By asking guitarists, I tap into a whole bunch of info and ideas that help(ed) in making a decent decision. It's a bit like asking friends what they think of a restaurant, a movie, or a certain car. They won't make the ultimate decison, but if you average all the opinions, it makes you aware of pros or cons that might save some headaches later. This board does this with strings and pedals all the time.
Since I only use the instruments to record, I was looking mostly for tone related opinions and build quality. I think I got a lot of good opinions and am grateful to those who responded. I can't try recording a particular guitar until I buy it and by then, it's a bit late to be disappointed. I ended up buying a Gretsch G5120 and will try and record with it once my hands are healthy again (long story). If it doesn't cut it in terms of tone, I'll consider the upgrades that have been recommended by the other G5120 owners. The tuners look really cheap and will probably need to go.
My final guitar (maybe next Spring) will most likely either be a Taylor Standard solid body or a Strat/Tele. Tom

If limited to just Strat or Gretsch, I would choose the Gretsch.

But since you mentioned a Tele as a possibility, I would also recommend looking into a Jazzmaster. A slightly different slice of the Fender pie, but a tasty piece of rhubarb nonetheless.

I've never liked Fender guitars since I started playing in 1962. they sound "cheesy" and "bubblegummy", have no character
A Gretsch has a lot more "body", no pun intended.

But everybody wants to be a clone of Jimi Hendrix, so be my guest...