Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

evan said... The 4001 reverted to Klusons in late '73 due to some QC/design issues with the Grovers.

i believe that would be later in '74 ?

krohurte wrote:Thanks for infos. So it's all rather cosmetic only?

The serial number revealed a 1973 that got offered to me as a 1976 though.

Well there is the Toaster pick up at the neck

Among its other wonderful benefits, this forum is ever educational; I learned something new over breakfast, and I haven't even cracked my law books open yet today.

BAD RONBO, KiLLeR DWaRfS wrote:evan said... The 4001 reverted to Klusons in late '73 due to some QC/design issues with the Grovers.

i believe that would be later in '74 ?

------------------------------------------------------
1971 - Grover sealed back machine heads replaced Schaller open back nickel machine
heads

1975 - Schaller BMC chrome open back machine heads replaced Grover sealed back
machine heads

From the link you provided a few days ago.....no mention of Kluson's between 1971 & 1975. An oversight?
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=20652&p=20652&hilit ... a6f#p20652

Already covered, but, again from my perspective~

A toaster both looks and sounds better than a hi gain. The old style tailpiece simply does not lift, giving far superior function, (and therefore appearance ) in that department than later models.

Intonation is another subject altogether!

wints wrote:Already covered, but, again from my perspective~

A toaster both looks and sounds better than a hi gain. The old style tailpiece simply does not lift, giving far superior function, (and therefore appearance ) in that department than later models.

*Intonation is another subject altogether!

*More 'refinable' Intonation vs Tail Lift.

*Toasters vs High-gains. (expecting johnallg to weigh in here!).

*Looks - degree of significance?

Good debates forever.

johnnysain wrote:

BAD RONBO, KiLLeR DWaRfS wrote:evan said... The 4001 reverted to Klusons in late '73 due to some QC/design issues with the Grovers.

i believe that would be later in '74 ?

------------------------------------------------------
1971 - Grover sealed back machine heads replaced Schaller open back nickel machine
heads

1975 - Schaller BMC chrome open back machine heads replaced Grover sealed back
machine heads

From the link you provided a few days ago.....no mention of Kluson's between 1971 & 1975. An oversight?
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=20652&p=20652&hilit ... a6f#p20652

i'm seeing graham's '69 with grovers ans possibly squire's as well if it's a '69 , so i would think grover was from '69 to '74 era. there were no kluson/schaller open backs from '69ish 'to '74ish era as far as i know thru this forum. i know some sneaky swine will pull out a specimen that will blow this thread apart.

johnnysain wrote:

wints wrote:Already covered, but, again from my perspective~

A toaster both looks and sounds better than a hi gain. The old style tailpiece simply does not lift, giving far superior function, (and therefore appearance ) in that department than later models.

*Intonation is another subject altogether!

*More 'refinable' Intonation vs Tail Lift.

*Toasters vs High-gains. (expecting johnallg to weigh in here!).

*Looks - degree of significance?

Good debates forever.

i know my MD-1252 toaster sounds just as good as my MJ-4844 higain and they both sound incredible. i would say my MD-1252 flat,slot screw treble higain sounds way better than the MJ-4844 button dometop higain ever did.

My Jan. 1969 4001 Burgundyglo had Klusons, fwiw!

And of course, closed back Grovers were used occasionally well after '74. Here's my '84 4003:

BAD RONBO, KiLLeR DWaRfS wrote:evan said... The 4001 reverted to Klusons in late '73 due to some QC/design issues with the Grovers.

i believe that would be later in '74 ?

The Grovers definitely petered out in '74 (typical Rickenbacker transition). However, I think there was a mix of Kluson and Grover equipped basses being made from late '73 to late '74 - I can remember seeing at least one very late '73 4001 sporting Klusons (period correct - the retainers had slot-heads) - maybe a "test" of the "new" tuners? Of course, at my age, memory ain't what it used to be, if it ever was.....

johnnysain wrote:
------------------------------------------------------
1971 - Grover sealed back machine heads replaced Schaller open back nickel machine
heads

1975 - Schaller BMC chrome open back machine heads replaced Grover sealed back
machine heads

From the link you provided a few days ago.....no mention of Kluson's between 1971 & 1975. An oversight?
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=20652&p=20652&hilit ... a6f#p20652

Sad to say, but the Schaller reference is probably in error - my '74 has the famous nickel-plated reverse Klusons, and I have another set of Klusons taken from a '77 4001. Cosmetically they are very similar after Kluson adopted the Phillips-head retaining screws in the later '70s, which may explain the "oversight". The cosmetic differences are the plating (nickel v chrome); the "rivet" attaching the Kluson clover leaf to the tuner shaft and the Kluson shaft-retaining brackets that protrude from the body of the tuner - this initially required a little routing at the peghead in order for the tuners to sit flat (later RIC used black plastic spacers between the peghead and tuner). There is, of course, always the possibility that Schaller made tuners to Kluson spec as a special order for RIC...but I doubt it.

The Grovers definitely made a comeback in the early '80s - just before the Rickenbacker-branded Schallers that we all know and love were introduced. I'm not sure why...was there a crate of tuners hiding in a corner? Did Grover convince RIC to give them another shot? They definitely only lasted for a very short period... Maybe as a stop-gap between Kluson supply drying up and Schaller supply coming on line?

phew quite a lot of information. And here comes the next question, which strays from the original issue but no need to start another topic, no?

So here goes:

I got an offer for a white 1975. The seller says it's quite rare so I just wonder about the resale value IF I shouldn't get used to it because I find myself a bit struggling with the white finish....

about the resale value: I'm not wanting to get rich, I'm rather wondering about the chances of reselling it. I'm quite new to Rickyworld.

'75 Rick?.....no problem reselling that! (attracting bidders on Ebay).....especially 'all-original' ....(I guess it's a 'Tuxedo' Rick)...probably at a profit too, depending on what you'll have paid and how long you'll hold onto it.

Some price averages.....http://www.rickresource.com/register/vi ... php?id=290