Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

winston wrote:Collin I can do two things for you................change the title of the thread to something far more friendly or delete it entirely. Of course the other alternative is to do neither of those things. Your choice. Let me know.

Thanks for the offer Brian, but no need --- I'd rather let it sit to plead with others to be more tactful when posting a thread that makes basically makes a broad accusation without any substantial evidence.

Now, let's start the "How to identify genuine Rickenbacher Truss Rod Covers" thread and be on our merry way.

collin wrote:As the seller of an item...My responsibilites do not include educating the general public about what to look for in a fake part.

Why not? A simple addendum to your ad stating "this is a real item, look closely in my pictures at such and such, fake ones have..." would go a long way in alleviating any wary buyers and would prevent someone like this original poster being so accusatory.

If I were selling an item in which I know many fakes are sold I would go out of my way to emphasize that my item is the real deal. All it would take is a sentence or two pin-pointing exactly what to look for. And if all it takes is a sentence or two to educate and allay the fears of any possible buyers, how can that hurt?

Well, there is the idea that working too hard to point out all of the flaws in the fakes will only serve to educate the fakers on how to make their "products" better...

cjj wrote:Well, there is the idea that working too hard to point out all of the flaws in the fakes will only serve to educate the fakers on how to make their "products" better...

Exactly.

Plus, as a buyer -- wouldn't you mistrust a seller who spends more time pointing out the minutae of fakes and why their item is real rather than just offering it up for sale confident that it's the real thing?

Tom - visit http://www.rolex.com and tell me how many lines they dedicate to informing consumers how to spot a fake? I sure don't see any.

collin wrote: Thanks for the offer Brian, but no need --- I'd rather let it sit to plead with others to be more tactful when posting a thread that makes basically makes a broad accusation without any substantial evidence. Now, let's start the "How to identify genuine Rickenbacher Truss Rod Covers" thread and be on our merry way.

...Good call Collin. I'm no fan of re-writing history...IMHO better to let free thinking people make their own judgements about matters-in-hand based on an open discussion (as long as it's conducted in a civil and orderly fashion...)..

I think you're right about the ebay listing. It's not a seller's job to write a book in the listing on how to identify a fake. Besides, I think you've always gone the extra mile in all your listings which I've seen to post multiple high quality close up pictures so an informed buyer can readily determine whether your item is what they are looking for.. very few listings that I see on eBay are as comprehensive.

Collin despite obviously being put off by the title, I applaud your decision to leave the thread as is. I also am not a fan of rewriting history. It never teaches those who follow what paths and pitfalls have been challenging and have been overcome by those who preceded them.

Cheers,

Brian

Right on, thanks Ed! Glad to see the photos are appreciated.

cjj wrote:Well, there is the idea that working too hard to point out all of the flaws in the fakes will only serve to educate the fakers on how to make their "products" better...

No doubt you are correct there. However, I would still go the extra mile to ensure buyers that in a world of fakes, my item is real. If you don't want to pinpoint certain things in fear of aiding the fakers, then offering a provenance is a plus.

If someone goes on ebay and offers a Babe Ruth signed basbeall, wouldn't you expect not just pictures pointing out the accuracy of the signature, but a story detailing how the seller got the ball? Look, this trc isn't a five dollar item. We are paying very good money for a simple piece of plastic. Offering up a provenance that the item is real - perhaps a simple chain of events of how one obtained the item, or a picture of the actual guitar it came from, or something - then that would work to alleviate any unnecessary (and insulting) skepticism.

That ad placed by the member here is absolutely fabulous with pictures. Yet, still someone came here and was accusatory and skeptical.

collin wrote:Tom - visit http://www.rolex.com and tell me how many lines they dedicate to informing consumers how to spot a fake? I sure don't see any.

Come on, that's a real company and their website. If one buys a Rolex from Rolex, you'd have to be the world's biggest cynic to think you are getting a fake. I don't think many people would be skeptical buying a Rolex from Rolex. But if you see a Rolex on ebay, would you place 100% trust in the seller that it is genuine?

You know your item genuine, I know your item is genuine, the members here know your item is genuine...but is that small group everyone in the world who uses ebay? Wouldn't you want to assuage any wary buyers of their apprehension regarding an item that is known to often be faked?

All I am saying was it would just take a sentence or two. Without that sentence you get the guy who comes here thinking fake. As you said, "guilty before proven innocent."

Just a PS:

Please don't be offended by this discussion. I actually think it's a good one. I have to be honest with you, maybe not as much as you, but I too am offended by the original poster here more or less accusing you of forgery. All I say is that maybe there was a way that that could have been stopped before it started.

Cool item, by the way. I was looking for one about three months ago and after all the insane hassle I went through to make my own, I would surely have paid the two bills for yours. Yours looks better and is real.

Tommy wrote:That ad placed by the member here is absolutely fabulous with pictures. Yet, still someone came here and was accusatory and skeptical.

And..... responsibility for said person's skepticism and lack of knowledge falls on my shoulders? I just don't think it does.

Tom - we'll just have to agree to disagree here. A seller of a signed baseball isn't obligated to waste time or energy pointing out a fake and I highly doubt anybody paying thousands of dollars for such a collectible would be so clueless about how to spot a fake that they would need a tutorial before purchase. Anyways, pictures say 1000 words anyways, right?

We should vote for a new page at Rickenbacker.com dedicated to spotting fakes!

Thanks Tom -- i'm not offended by this conversation at all, I just find it highly amusing that people are so wound up about buying a fake item that, rather than looking for details that make an item real -- they basically pull the flag on something, despite a number of huge, high-res photos. That's not even ignorance, it's just lazy.

but despite that, i'm just not going to degrade myself or my item by having to give a tutorial about spotting fakes on MY ebay auction page. Done. Period. Finito.

collin wrote:...A seller of a signed baseball isn't obligated to waste time or energy pointing out a fake and I highly doubt anybody paying thousands of dollars for such a collectible would be so clueless about how to spot a fake that they would need a tutorial before purchase.

Mike Gutierrez can give you the tutorial.

I still think is a faker. The c58's TRC is thicker and this one is "skinny". the "Rickenbacker" name is way down. isn't that suppose to be in the middle?

Casiraghi22 wrote:I still think is a faker. The c58's TRC is thicker and this one is "skinny". the "Rickenbacker" name is way down. isn't that suppose to be in the middle?

I still know you're incorrect.

Well, I posted pics of my TRC. Let's see your pics that prove otherwise.

Nelson--why would Collin, a long-standing, respected member of this and other Rickenbacker groups, risk his reputation for the sake of a couple of hundred bucks and change?

C'mon...of course it's real.

I could show you production RIC TRCs from the mid-'70s, on which the lettering literally touches the edge of the plastic!

Although standards and manufacturing processes have tightened up substantially in recent years, there is still the odd one that pushes the QC envelope. Charming, I say.