Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

iiipopes wrote:The reason for serial numbers is to affirm authenticity. With so many hackers, butchers and scammers, I am glad documentation is available.

+1

As one river said to another, "My sediments, exactly!" ...

A little off-topic, but a side benefit of having such a record of serial numbers is that It's a good way of recording potential future problems and resolving them. When I recorded a recent acquisition in the Registry, I did not use the SN that was on the plate attached to the bass - this should never have been on the bass in the first place as it belongs to an entirely different, later instrument, belonging to someone else. Instead. I used the correct SN, which I have proof belongs on my bass, and I have since added this correct SN to a blank plate and mounted it on the bass. The original SN plate was apparently lost.

If the original SN plate ever turns up, if and when the owner of that bass attempts to record it in the Registry, he or she will realise that it's already recorded under my details and post here or PM me. At that point, hopefully both basses can then be reunited with the correct numbers once again, as I've retained the incorrect plate.

I can see where jdog's coming from but, on balance, I think as full a set of records as possible is valuable.

Ash

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?


Plus the register will NEVER be complete and is riddled with inaccurate information. Why even bother?

I love this!!! Everyone start posting your VIN's! C'mon, do it!

jdogric12 wrote:

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?


Plus the register will NEVER be complete and is riddled with inaccurate information. Why even bother?

I love this!!! Everyone start posting your VIN's! C'mon, do it!

LM23HOR ...

(That's the start of the VIN on every 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger 340, for those not in the know. )

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?


Plus the register will NEVER be complete and is riddled with inaccurate information. Why even bother?

I have watched this discussion here and elsewhere on the RRF and accept that there are arguments for and against the merits of the Register.

Whilst I recognise that the database MAY be of merit in verifying the provenance of a particular guitar and reducing the risk of fraud, I must say that I tend to agree with Collin on this one.

Why? Well, I own many Rickenbackers and I have a fundamental problem with the principle that a third party should be allowed to register details about an instrument which I have paid for and own - in fact, the more I think about this, I believe it is a gross infringement of my rights for someone to go on to the RRF and post details about my property. Here in the UK, we have stringent Data Protection legislation and I am pretty sure that what goes on in the RRF Register right now is a breach of the spirit and indeed letter of the law. If I want to register my instrument on the Register, that is my choice, but what gives anyone else the right to do so without my permission?

I also agree that the information recorded can be completely misleading. The Register database for many/most of my Rics is hopelessly wrong. For example, my 610-6 FG (F8 7288) and 610-12 FG (F8 7519) are shown as being in Missouri and New York respectively, when they are now both in the UK. Likewise, my 480 MG (NI 5535) is still shown as being located in California, whereas it is also here in the UK. These anomalies arise because when guitars are sold privately via the RRF, there is no way for a third party to know what price was paid or where the guitars end up, so the Register just ends up being more out-of-date and inaccurate.

The situation with eBay is equally confusing. Because of the exorbitant level of eBay and PayPal fees, quite a few buyers (including myself) are choosing to buy directly (outside eBay), where possible. So, for example, when I bought my 'W' series 330-6 directly from the Sound Affects Premier website a few weeks ago (see RRF topic viewtopic.php?f=3&t=410900&start=45), the original listing on eBay was cancelled by SAP and the Register now shows 'Appeared on eBay, item number 231213860885, auction ended at 2014-04-28 17:21:31, Did not sell by soundaffectspremier at $2509.18'. This is of course complete bunkum, as the 330-6W is now in my collection in Northern Ireland and the price which I paid is purely a personal matter between myself and the dealer - and it is for me to decide whether or not I choose to disclose this information. So what is the point of the entry on the Register, when it is completely wrong?

In short, I believe that whilst the Register may be of benefit to RRF members in some circumstances, entries to the Register should be restricted to RRF members who actually own the guitars in question ..... and, NO, I have no idea how this could be policed!!

I would rather see 5,000 entries in the Register which are largely accurate, rather than 15,000 which are either factually inaccurate, out of date or, worse still, complete rubbish!

doctorwho wrote:

jdogric12 wrote:

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?


Plus the register will NEVER be complete and is riddled with inaccurate information. Why even bother?

I love this!!! Everyone start posting your VIN's! C'mon, do it!

LM23HOR ...

(That's the start of the VIN on every 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger 340, for those not in the know. )

DartIn1976_cr.jpg

I've always favored the '73

As far as I know, anyone who doesn't want "their property" listed in the register can ask to have it removed.

It is against the rules (or used to be) to post serial numbers obtained from other than publicly available sources, i.e., serial numbers already available to the general public...

jdogric12 wrote:(in response to no one in particular) Just wait til someone files a police report with your serial number and you hear a knock at the door.

Seriously? You think this is going to happen to someone?

Interestingly I just remembered that some RIC dealers share instrument serial numbers.

jdogric12 wrote:

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?

Plus the register will NEVER be complete and is riddled with inaccurate information. Why even bother?

I love this!!! Everyone start posting your VIN's! C'mon, do it!

Over here the VIN is actually the only thing that can be shared freely, it's the owner's info that is protected by law! Besides, criminals do not care what VIN belongs to what model/year/colour - I know that from experience working in automotive!

As for people who want to sell a fake - what about the bogus s/n? Most people wanting to buy a Rickie have no clue how the s/n system works. Of course, someone will now complain I make it easier for some chinese who can not read english to create random s/n for an instrument which looks nothing like a real Rickie...

Gibson Custom re-use s/n for '57 - '60 Les Paul reissues - about once every decade an s/n is used, and as it does not mention a year of manufacture. Other models use CS###### now how would you know that those s/n are real or fake? For Rickies there is at least a register one might check to see if it is real or not. Might be the s/n might be unknown to us, but people would post to find out! Imo the register is a positive thing!

The Register provides valuable information all in one place and is offered to those who wish to learn about these instruments. Those who already know everything will not need to refer to it. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but in the balance it is favourably received by those looking to learn more about specific eras. Sorry to all those that are offended. We try our very best here.

electrofaro wrote:

collin wrote:Stop the madness!!

Let's imagine for a minute these were automotive VIN. Collecting/posting these would be illegal in the United States. Why shouldn't that respect be paid to other belongings?

Over here the VIN is actually the only thing that can be shared freely, it's the owner's info that is protected by law!

I suspect the same thing is true in the U.S. After all, there's nothing in a VIN that's not freely available on the internet other than tying the actual sequential production number of the VIN to a particular automobile. And if someone wants to get that, all they have to do is read it through the windshield.

Same thing with the RRF Register, no ownership info is supposed to be posted with the entries. Now, posting the location may be edging a bit towards invasion of privacy, but as already noted, that's fairly inaccurate since it's rarely updated when an instrument gets sold/moved...

admin wrote:...We try our very best here.

I, for one, appreciate that immensely.

Yeah one of my basses came back with a different serial number on it after restoration. It had gone from a 68 to a 96! LOL

It got sorted out though.

8mileshigh wrote:Yeah one of my basses came back with a different serial number on it after restoration. It had gone from a 68 to a 96! LOL

It got sorted out though.

In terms of publicly outing those responsible for mine going from a 76 to a 79, I'm taking the patient route so I'm still awaiting that moment of pleasure....

Yep. A long time coming - if it's the guy I'm thinking of.