Finally hearing music again

[kenposurf]

I've been doing without the machine, but to keep from ruining the records (typical temps at the needle tip are ~300°F and can melt vinyl if dirt causes too much friction!) and an expensive cartridge, cleaning is a must, even on newer records. So, run some warm soapy water, scrub with your fingers, dry with a cotton cloth or towel. You might want to invest in a record cleaning brush (Discwasher) system, only a few bucks. I'm about ready to pop for one of the VMI? $500.00 cleaners, but they do take up space. Don't play a dirty record!

Thanks for the spelling correction Paul..I always mess that one up!
Before you plunk down the 5 bills for the VMI you might check out the "Record Doctor" Same as the Nitty Gritty but you have to rotate the platter instead of having a motor do it for you..about $300 for that one...I was looking at some of the cleaners..wow..a VMI for $2600 some other one for over 3 grand...

[ken_j]

Too bad I sold my VMI 16.5 for about $250 a few years ago there would probably have been some interest here. It is as good as you would need. The Thorens 125 with a SME arm followed shortly behind it. I still have my AGI preamp and VSP Labs power amp though but may decide whether to keep that within the near future.

Marc I would recommend looking for a used Thorens as they can be reasonably purchased. The thing to remember is the higher the Model number the lower the features/quality. The TD 125 was at the top followed by the TD160 and 165. Later (sometime in the '80s I believe) they downgraded the 160 and then brought out the 160 Super (back to what it was) and the TD145. The difference being the bearing diameter. The better ones were 10mm if my memory serves me right the later plain 160's and all the 165's were at about 8mm.

Thorens TD125 with SME arm, AKG cartridge, and Oracle Groove Isolator record mat setting on a Discwasher marble turntable suspension system.

[marc61]

Hmmmm..There is a Thorens I had my eye on. It's TD 295 MkIV. Guy is looking for an offer around $600.He says it has a Grado Reference Platinum cartridge on it, and he'll deduct $150 off the price without the cartridge.

Nervous about buying anything used though, without seeing it and hearing it from a private person

[ken_j]

I am not familiar with this model but it looks to be much newer than the 125 and 160 that I had owned. If you pull the outer platter and belt off you can pull up the center of the platter to see the diameter of the shaft and bearing, the bigger the better. This sits in an oil bath for lube. The total weight of the platter assembly on the older Thorens were somewhere between 9 and 12 pounds, the heavier the better as it will maintain its speed more accurately. The 125 that I pictured above has electronic speed control via a strobe, plus the motor was 2 to 3 times larger than the 160. The 125 also weighs in about 30 lbs. heavier due to its superior suspension (probably between 40 to 50 pounds total). Now that I think about it when they went to the newer 160 model I seem to recall it having an external power supply and a lower voltage motor. The earlier one had a 120 volt synchronous motor.

The 295 you pictured appears to have a Grace tone arm. I am not positive because I can't see it clear enough. The Grace is a decent arm as is the Grado cartridge. I don't know if a used Grado is worth $150 without making a few calls.

[longboard_ric]

There's something about vinyl, the purists say, that the CD format cannot reproduce. While I cannot disagree with that, like many others I found the convenience of the CD format too hard to resist, and all of my vinyl remains packed away along with my old turntable.

I recently purchased The Beatles Remasters (Stereo), and was looking forward to a whole new experience. I haven't played them all yet, but while there certainly is a marked improvement compared to previous CD issues, I couldn't help but cast my mind back to the early eighties.

In 1983, I purchased a copy of Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs The Beatles Collection Half Speed Masters. Normally they did a run of 5000, however demand was so great they extended the run to 25000. I played them quite a few times, always with great care (they cost $600). Some years later, in need of some cash, I sold them.

In terms of quality, the equipment I have now is comparable to what I had in the eighties; not high end stuff by any means but producing good quality results.

As I listen to the CD Remasters, I can't help but recall listening to the MFSL vinyl.

Even with the passage of 25 years I am convinced there is no comparison.

The MFSL Half Speed Masters is a far superior product. I wish I still had them.

[johnallg]

So J Gordon is gone... quite a loss indeed. RIP.

I used to chase the muse, found it very expensive, and ended up modifying good equipment to sound great. Modified the digital and analog sections of CD players to greatly improve the sound, and wrote 3 articles in an amateur publication detailing the changes. Used to build my own speakers too. All this reminds me my buddy still owes me a Dual 1019 (1219 ??) from a trade a few years ago. Gotta collect.....

Anyone interested in VTL MB100 monoblocks, built by David Manley in Great Britain (SN 72 and 73 IIRC)? I have had them for over 20 years but not played them much at all. Never really bonded with them. They had been modified by the guy in Florida I bought them from but I sent them to Luke at the factory (back when he still owned VTL (a whole 'nother saga!)) and they rebuilt them to the original circuit, put in bias test points, and retubed as needed.

I have *** Nikko Alpha 220 amp that I've modified with a LOT of PS capacitance, wiring upgrades, and coupling cap improvements. It runs class A up to a few watts (10??) then AB and once fully warmed up (about 30 minutes), is very open and smooth sounding. Backup amp is a 1963 Mac 240 w/black plate RCA 6L6s.

I need to clean out from the basement my "kids" junk they left when they moved out so I can set up a proper listening area. Right now it is just CDs through the TV surround system. Barely tolerable.

[jps]

I met David Manley at the first Stereophile Hi Fi Show in Santa Monica in the late '80s. Interesting guy!

Regarding the MFSL LPs I still have my Renaissance Sheherezade LP.

[doctorwho]

It's cool to read the threads and see that the 'old school' of sound reproduction is alive and well.

That said, I never liked MP3s and never really used them, being that I have a "phonographic memory" (sorry for the pun, but it's the truth!) and can remember exactly how a song sounded when I first heard it on a phonograph (this does drive me nuts sometimes - e.g., I have never found on any album (old or modern) the original 45 version of The Animals' "It's My Life" - the intro is different from what is in print). Every MP3 I heard always sounded "flat" or "empty" (it is difficult to put precise wording here) compared with what was stored in my memory. Because of the perceived poor quality, I never saw the attraction of MP3s as a valid audio medium.

[jps]

As a high fidelity medium I agree with you. There is a useful need for the MP3 format, it being the ease of transferring music to others who need the "basic information" it can provide. The Karma Kings use them all the time as a learning tool, we send them to each other so we can learn the songs we play. For that use the high fidelity nature is not as important as the ability to get across the song structure and the notes/inflections we need to study.

[cjj]

MP3s sound bad because it is a compressed format utilizing a "lossy" compression algorithm. This makes for a smaller data file, but it does lose information.

I do find MP3s to be quite useful though, as Jeff said, for easy passing of info to others and also for their convenience when providing music is listening environments that are not exactly conducive to high fidelity such as cars (or in my case, tractors)...

[blue330]

It is also possible to find a KLH Model 20 (for hardly any money) and get a notably robust and pleasant sound if you've only been listening to garden-variety modern stuff.

[marc61]

A quick internet search shows there are others in your camp Mitch. I just saw a youtube video where a model 20 record player was picked up at an estate sale. Hard to judge the quality through computer speakers but, the collector mentioned he felt that it was excellent sound quality for an inexpensive piece. Besides, who wouldn't want something as cool as this in the den:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mid-Modern-KLH-20-P ... 2a02542c97


Last night I was listening to an Elvis Costello bootleg(50,000 Elvis fans can't be wrong) on vinyl for the first time in many years. I had thoughts of converting these recordings to mp3s to "carry them around" Now I'm thinking they're best left where they are.

[johnallg]

I remember KLH speakers as sounding very even and uncongested for an inexpensive line.

[jingle_jangle]

I have one of Henry Kloss' mid '60s Model 20 component systems in storage right now...lovely light maple in color with wheat-colored grille cloth and a cool light beige turntable, subtle, understated, and a design classic.

Oh, yeah, and for its day, amazing fidelity.

[jps]

We have the classic KLH table radio for the good old days which still works great.