Benoit David out.

[ajish4]

Time to turn the page guys.

I miss Jon as well, but I hope the band continues to go forward and produce some new music as a result. I think FFH was a great gift to we fans long awaiting for another YES studio recording.

As Jim said, just another chapter in the book of YES. I hope the book continues for years to come.

There will come a point when they will no longer be able to tour or record at all. THEN we will long for the days of seeing ANYTHING resembling YES. I will truly miss them when they aren't performing in any form. They just don't make musicians like these guys anymore. Personally, I'm very grateful we still have them touring and recording today.

[woodyng]

amen,brother Tony!

how's that genesis lyric go,"we'll never see the likes of them again"....

hopefully all concerned parties will continue to do what comes best to them-produce great music, in whatever form it ends up taking for them to do that.

[Billsbro]

The last two posts are especially good! Thanks!
And as the song title states, life is "Perpetual Change."

We humans get into trouble so often because we want to hold on to life as seems at one given moment in time. Not only does that damage our future enjoyment but it keeps us from enjoying the very moment we want to last. If we let go of the attachment and the fear of change the past, the present, and the future seems...perfect.

Fly From Here is a wonderful now. The new live CD is a wonderful now.
Tomorrow will be different but I bet it will be wonderful too.

[walker]

Wow - what a development! All this political drama aside, it's cool to see a "local boy done good" for the new position of lead singer. 'Sky Cries Mary' was one of my fav bands when I lived in Seattle. That band had a ton of talent revolve through it as well - some members went on to form bands such as The Posies, Sage, Sunny Day Real Estate... and I think the keyboard player produced the mega-hit debut album by The Strokes.

Here's a clip of the work Jon Davison did with the Roundabout tribute band:

[Droog61]

You got to be kidding?

Call me a hopeless cynic but YES to me, is a parody of their former selves, becoming nothing more then a cabaret act. (sorry gotta call it like I see it)

Squire & co really need to look at getting Jon Anderson and Rick W back.

A band is more then the music it produces, its about the players, the talent and the chemistry (volatile or not) of those involved.

Truthfully,I never really dug Yes as much as I did when Buford was in the band but I stuck in there,(true they put out some good albums after his departure). He really brought out the best in Squires playing.
In fact I'd go as far as saying Bruford's playing style 'helped' put Squire on the awesome bass player map.

They are floating around nowadays half band and half tribute act... and they can get away with it due to the fan base emotional attachment from an earlier era just to have anything stamped Yes.
As a Yes fan from the early years (first 5 albums) I am really disappointed in the current approach. Bring back Jon Anderson and Rick Wakeman and I will gladly drop good coin to see them

They may be calling themselves YES, but it's nowhere near the YES I knew and became a fan of... It's really the Squire, Howe & White band doing Yes (Once again sorry, but I got to call it like I see it)

My 2 cent rant, over and out

Cheers

[just_bassics]

Thanks for your opinion, Andrew. We all have them.

I for one am happy to have Fly From Here and hope the next one is just as good, whomever happens to be contributing at the time. As long as Chris and Steve are working together, I'm happy.

As for the rumours floating around, I pay as much attention to those as any other gossip - I don't. A band puts it's money where it's mouth is when they release new material and / or take the stage for the live performance. I've stated my opinion on the latest release, the concert performances are up to the individual listener. I recently caught Anderson & Wakeman and, while it was very good to my ears, they are showing their age as well. It's just natural.

Should they keep going? I also love the Moody Blues, Zeppelin, Badfinger, The Beatles, Deep Purple, ELP, and many more who have long since stopped contributing. Every day that Yes keeps working is a good day for me. They have the right to practise their trade and earn a living. Don't like it? Don't buy it. Not a rant, not my 2 cents, just the way it is.

[Droog61]

Jim you are correct 100%
(and personally I don't buy it (fly from here), just isn't my cup of tea )

I still listen to Howe's solo work for years and appreciate it and you are also absolutely correct that its great for the guys (Howe, Squire and White) to make a living. To be a musician in this day and age (not a lip syncing spandex clad performer backed up by a dance troop and an auto tuner) and be able to tour and have demand is an awesome thing!

Not criticizing anyone for liking them in their current line up or recordings. Nor am I a person that wouldn't want to see a musician(s) progress. Every band will have work that will define them that other efforts will be compared to, and to add to the challenge is one with member swap outs.

Perhaps the current members are beyond Yes in their new work? I think as long as they have the moniker (or even baggage?) of the name hanging over them with such a rich history, there will always be a debate of how the fans define them.

And to steal your line 'That's just the way it is'

Cheers,

[just_bassics]

Thanks Andrew, and re-reading my last post, I may have come across a tad harsh which is never my intention.

Yes are and always have been a band of strong musicians. As a result, each of the members over the years have developed their own following. As a guitarist / bassist, I love the combination of Howe & Squire. I was mortified in the 80s when Trevor Rabin appeared on the scene, but quickly learned to appreciate his contribution and the three strong (IMO) albums that he produced with the band. Fortunately, I haven't had to witness Squire's departure, although at the ABWH show in 89, as good as it was and as great as Tony Levin played that night, I still kept finding myself looking for Chris. But that's another story.

Anderson, Wakeman, Bruford, Rabin, Banks and others will always have strong followings whose fans want to see them back in the lineup, but they are as they are and whining about it on guitar forums won't help - Right Thomas?

[aceonbass]

To call YES half band and half tribute act isn't even accurate. Except the singer, everyone in the band is either a long standing member or has history with the band. After all, YES has had something like 18 members, so change is arguably what keeps them among the oldest current performing bands around. Moraz only did one album with them, but what a great album it was, and it wouldn't have sounded like it does with Wakeman. Downes has done only two records with them, yet Drama is one of my faveorite albums by them, even without Anderson. It's not like there are a ton of bands like this out there touring, so I'll take another YES tour as long as they can still do it.

[Billsbro]

Andrew,
I don't think you ranted. You simply stated your opinion and you didn't do it in inflammatory way. Thank you! Like Jim, I absolutely feel that your opinion is valid for you and for some other former-fans as well. I never have a problem with other people's feelings and opinions as long as they don't try to force it on others (and you are not doing that). Your line of logic is not something new and it has been applied to many other bands and solo musicians. I think the only thing that I would want to know is whether you apply that same logic evenly to other bands because frankly, if you look at this line of thought logically, it should be applied to the vast majority of popular music acts, and in many cases, it should be applied/have been applied at relatively early stages of their careers. The following bands leap to mind: Genesis, ELP, the Rolling Stones, The Who, Pink Floyd, Van Halen, Greatful Dead, The Beach Boys, Kansas, Dream Theater, Eric Clapton, Bruce Springsteen, Metallica, Moody Blues, Jethro Tull, The Cars, Fleetwood Mac, The Allman Bros, Frank Zappa, Camel, King Crimson, and Gong. All of these bands have lost members and changed their style and approach. There are dozens more. I think this kind of logic can apply to all genres of music including the classical and international music scene. Do you feel the same way about these bands? Have these bands become half-bands and/or tribute bands because their membership has changed? Or, do you feel this way in general but make exceptions for some bands that have a special, personal and emotional connection for you? My personal opinion is that there would be very few bands to listen to if I discounted all bands that had membership changes and/or stylistic changes. I think I would be cheating myself out of a lot of wonderful and thought-provoking music. As you may suspect, for me, Yes is one of those bands that I make an exception for.

Please understand that I know that I am highly opininated. My opinions often go against the establishment. I never have a problem with folks that have very different feelings, likes, dislikes, passions, and opinions. My strongest personal bias is the love of logic and fairness. I try to be fair and logical but yet I know that I am not always logical. My sentimental side sometimes wins out and I find myself liking something that I know goes against my logical side. The band Yes is a perfect example. I was sad when Bill Bruford left the band. He is my favorite drummer. (I am a drummer first and foremost.) I was sad when Wakeman left each time. No one plays quite like him. I have a stack of keyboards and he is a huge influence. I was sad when Yes went through the big changes/splits in the 80's. At first. But then I kept an open mind. I then found the wonderful music Billy B did with Crimson. I found out how wonderful Alan White was. I was sad when Steve wasn't part of Chris' version of the band. I was sad when Jon wasn't involved. But I listened to the amazing new music that the various versions of Yes put out. I listened to the solo efforts by all the members. I was very happy to have so much new music. In short, I realized that all things change and that there is usually a mix of positive and negative results. I am so hungry for good music so I try to let go of my pre-conceived notions and emotions.

I personally listen to music for many reasons. Sometimes I want to be re-assured about things; I want to regress a bit and remember a more simple time when things seemed less complex and more enjoyable. I listen to music to push myself, to grow, to be challenged , and most of all to move my own musicianship and compositional skills forward. Sometimes I am too serious. Sometimes I am too playful and shallow. But I always try to stimulate the thoughts of others. Your post made me think more deeply and examine my own feelings. Thank you. Forgive me if this post is much too long. Music is my passion. I like to discuss it; I like a good conversation and I like to hear alternative views because I always grow and appreciate things even more. I hope I can do that occasionally for others. Thanks for listening and considering my points!

[just_bassics]

Wow, Stephen, I can't top that post!

I get the feeling a PM is headed my way...

[Billsbro]

Wow, Stephen, I can't top that post!

I get the feeling a PM is headed my way...

You sir, are BIASED! LOL! Thanks though!

[walker]

Everyone's "two cents" here is worth AT LEAST that. These are all good points and the personal perspectives are worth sharing. I like to think that I learn a great deal from what others see. My mind also went to Pink Floyd and Van Halen when talking about bands losing key founding members. I think I scrutinize replacements the same way most people do initially - how do they stack up compared to the original? There hasn't been mention of Wakeman v Tony Kaye, but I know that some have voiced their preferences for one over the other in that role. For me, and others as well I'm guessing, the switch from Bruford to White was a much larger change in the characteristic of the YES sound. My two cents: I find Bruford's style much more unique and distinguishable than White's. Bruford also has the advantage of having set the benchmark for the YES sound with the other 4-5 original members. But ask most seasoned drummers, and their two cents will tell you that White can drum circles around Bruford. (Drum circles! HA!) It took me awhile to warm up to White as well, but I had quite the epiphany one day after giving 'Yessongs' a good listen. White SHREDS on that album! And over the years, he's proven to be a much more accommodating player to the music, as opposed to Bruford who basically did his thing with a more myopic approach.

And with White's introduction came evolution to YES' sound & style, as it did with each personel change in the band's lineup over the decades. This evolution is key to growth and avoiding stagnancy. And in this way, it makes each phase all the more endearing. Would YES' whole catalog be as interesting and innovative if the same original 5 members had been producing the music all these years? Would we even be talking in terms of decadeS vs Yes: the band from the '70s? It's possible, given the prowess of the members as musicians, but less likely than if they did exactly what they did - pushed the envelope into new territories with new members and new perspectives. I read somewhere that after The Who put out 'Who's next?' - the following album ended up being trashed by Pete because he realized that it was basically a carbon copy of 'Who's Next?'

Every Yes fan has his/her bias on which is their favorite era, and this plays out to Yes' advantage in a big way. They have several demographics to play to, which has proven to be an effective business model for them. And God bless them for still having the ability to put something up the flagpole to find people saluting it after 40 years as a band.

[Billsbro]

A superb post there, Walker! Excellent points and observations!

I think your Bruford versus White paragraph is particularly good. I daresay that one could write a THESIS on this topic...there is that much complexity there. Each drummer brought out the excellence in the band but in different ways.

Keep it coming kids!

[Droog61]

[quote="Billsbro"]Andrew,
I don't think you ranted. You simply stated your opinion and you didn't do it in inflammatory way. Thank you! Like Jim, I absolutely feel that your opinion is valid for you and for some other former-fans as well. I never have a problem with other people's feelings and opinions as long as they don't try to force it on others (and you are not doing that). Your line of logic is not something new and it has been applied to many other bands and solo musicians. I think the only thing that I would want to know is whether you apply that same logic evenly to other bands because frankly, if you look at this line of thought logically, it should be applied to the vast majority of popular music acts, and in many cases, it should be applied/have been applied at relatively early stages of their careers. The following bands leap to mind: Genesis, ELP, the Rolling Stones, The Who, Pink Floyd, Van Halen, Greatful Dead, The Beach Boys, Kansas, Dream Theater, Eric Clapton, Bruce Springsteen, Metallica, Moody Blues, Jethro Tull, The Cars, Fleetwood Mac, The Allman Bros, Frank Zappa, Camel, King Crimson, and Gong. All of these bands have lost members and changed their style and approach. There are dozens more. I think this kind of logic can apply to all genres of music including the classical and international music scene. Do you feel the same way about these bands?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Good question, What an awesome forum to have great discussions!

Reflecting on the communities within the fan bass here... as I said previously a Band will have a line up which will define their sound, the work(s) that will set the benchmark for all comparisons. Line ups will play a HUGE part in that process.

Consider this,

When Yes broke big, people did not seem too upset about Banks leaving or Kaye.
They were exposed to the line up of Anderson, Squire, Howe, Wakeman and Bruford.
Their contribution were so unique they even had solo pieces to hi light and embed in our psyche their personal contributions.

What other band in your list did that? please name one I am either forgetful but can't remember one from that list where each member had a individual solo?
And if they did, Was it on a band milestone album like Fragile?

I mean we could argue until we are blue in the face, but I would wager 'Fragile' was the album that the mass collective of Yes fans fell in love with over, lets say Drama.

(Sorry getting off topic so back to Jon Anderson)

For some others it will be 90210 as a benchmark, Whole new generation of fans

However on each of these milestones Fragile and 90210, Anderson was present ( Kaye was the man on Keys). Anderson is part of the soundscape at both those milestones.

Guess that is why some us are die hard 'Anderson is a major part of the Yes sound' fans.
Does it say anywhere Chris, Steve, Alan cant write great music? no at all...
And just because one may not like the new yes line up doesn't mean we don't like Squire, Howe, Whites musical efforts? on again ..not at all.
It just means it doesn't fit the expectations of the 'Yes' some of us came to embrace.


Genesis for example, had a milestone with trick of the tale... made it easier for new fans, however if there only milestone was Selling England by the Pound, that would be another story. Same case with VH

Benoit is out... kiss and make up boys... get back Jon Anderson, he is touring now so he may as well tour with the Band he helped define... and get back in the studio next year