Gretsch Duojet and Filtertrons

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:51 pm

If you ever hold one in your hand, you would notice how heavy they are. They are chunky and thick. The bridge Powertron is even thicker.

Every manufacturer has a size that is "theirs". Rick single, Fender single, Gibson hummers and P-90s, etc. Gretsch are much more "soapbar" sized and weight that the so-called "soapbar" P-90s (which I think are called that not only because of shape but also ivory colored plastic cases).

admin · Post by **admin** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 3:13 am

I have always found the sound of the Gretsch humbucker to sound close to a single coil when not pushed hard. As such the Gretsch and Rickenbacker sounds, as history has shown, go together very nicely.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 6:30 am

I have always found the sound of Gibson hummers to be non-musical and very tiring when listened to at high volume or for extended periods, or both.

Gretsch double-coil (Like the FTs, PTs, MTs) have a smoother, "fruitier" tone, much more versatile and sophisticated, IMO.

History disagrees with me. (Les Pauls outnumber 6120s and their brethren by about 10 to one...)

admin · Post by **admin** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 6:48 am

Paul: As you know, Hummers are becoming more popular and are quite expensive.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 8:46 am

Har. "If you don't know the words, you're a hummer."

qmoder · Post by **qmoder** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 8:09 pm

Well I don't really want a Arnold Hummer.
But a Filtertron on steriods would just the ticket.
I too find that Les Paul's tend to get a little over the top when listened to for a long periods of time.
I heard and Eagles trib group followed by a Aerosmith trib group and by the end of the second group's show I was Les Pauled out.
I do have a Les Paul but its heavy and hard to keep in tune. So I rarely take it out of the case.
Its a nice looking guitar but just not very practical. I think I keep it around so I will never get the desire to buy another one.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:45 am

Thursday was Les' 90th birthday, as I'm sure you all know.

He's been regaled and tributed innumerable times over the years.

The sad news is that arthritis has made it impossible for him to play like he used to--even with cortisone shots, he can no longer play chords and has to limit himself to lead lines.

My own Top Five album of all time list (a tough one to compile!) would include "Chester and Lester", his 1976 duet with Chet Atkins, supposedly recorded extemporaneously in a Nashville studio, and captured, warts and all with fantastic sound quality for its day.

Although there's nothing but old chestnuts on the record ("Caravan", "'Deed I Do", "Moonglow"), and nary a country tune to be found, it won the Grammy that year for Best Country Instrumental Album.

It was followed by Guitar Monsters (1978), which in any other company would be a knockout, but for me it failed to recapture the sparkle of the first.

Incidentally, Chet's half-brother Jimmy played rhythm guitar for the Les Paul Trio in the 1940s.

I've been unable to locate a copy of either of these on CD. Borders says they can order them (now combined onto a double album). Amazon lists them used on CD at $80.00!

Maybe somebody out there can burn me a copy--mine on vinyl is in Brazil and I'm needing a fix.

qmoder · Post by **qmoder** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:46 pm

Sorry to hear that about Les. I thought that Les still played live in new york often. The last one he played a young rocker came up played a bit and kissed Les shoe. Les was quite moved.
You do have to keep your fingers limbered up. Playing actually seems to help mine from getting stiffness in them.
Back on the Gretsch. I look for guitars that have a good clean and overdrive with a personality of their own. I like a vibrato if possible but staying in tune with a lot of muss and fuss is important too. Since I bend a lot heavy guage strings are not my favorite and bending makes the guitar out of tune easier too.
From what I've read the Elliot Signature Duo Jet would be best for I'm asking the guitar to do.

My Ric with the highgains will pretty do all of that. So do my Strats. I can't say the same for my Les Paul.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:17 am

Dan, I think it's a good choice and would definitely consider an upgrade to TV's hottest and putting a set of locking tuners on it. A luthier would have to do the work if you can't--it's a fairly easy job.

qmoder · Post by **qmoder** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:23 pm

The EE model comes with locking tuners just another plus for it. I'm sure that I can handle the pickup's install myself. I have put schaller locking tuners on one of my Strats before after getting one that came with them. You just have to know the proper part number. You're right Paul its a good mod. Especially since that Strat had the slotted head tuners instead of the hole in the top like the present type of Ric tuners that were on my 360.
I have been thinking about how to raise the pickups if needed in the Gretsch. I know that you can get some paper thin rubber gaskets and that might be the way to go. I know too that the Gretsch pickups and TV's have the pole screws that can be raised and lowered but I don't know how effective that is on them?
Raising the Pickups on my Ric was like night and day. I was really surprized. I expected a little bit of difference but nothing that like this.
Strats don't respond to pickup height as much as the Ric did. But they do respond. So you never know about the Gretsch and how it would respond either? All guitars seem to have sweet spot.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:33 pm

Hey, Dan:

I'm finishing my Gretsch PROJEcT guitar, and part of the documentation is on how to make the pickups adjustable in height. It takes a router or vertical mill, however (mill preferred), and I'm sure you won't be wanting to do this to a brand new $1500.00 guitar!. I'll be posting links on the Gretsch Pages and here, too, with Peter's dispensation.

The EE is gorgeous. What made you pick it over the Cavern Jet?

You're right--every guitar pickup has its "sweet spot". Almost all pickups are in place in a sort of generalized "compromise" height due to rigidities of mass-production. So to be able to raise and lower a pickup (especially a hyper-sensitive one like a FT) does a lot to dial it in. I would only use polepiece screws to make up a difference in individual string volume. (Like between a plain and wound "G".

It's good that Fenders have pups that are height-adjustable. This sort of thing spoils you. Then you get a $2K Gretsch, and they're just nailed in there. Frustrating...But it can be fixed, just not with a Dremel and some sticky wax...

qmoder · Post by **qmoder** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 4:44 pm

Paul I would be greatly interested to hear about your Gretsch guitar project. Usually though complicated solutions eventually give way to a simpler way of doing the same thing. Its a trial and error thing and really in how you see the problem. I have a strong feeling you are on the verge of something.
The Ric pickups were just as adjustable as the Fender ones to me. Ric pickups sit on the top of the guitar of course and Fender's receed into the guitar. But since Ric's fretboard is still positioned just above the pickups the results are about the same. The Ric actually seemed to be more responsive.
I have some lace sensors on a couple of my Strats. These things can be moved very close to the strings as they have no magnetic pull on them. But still the Ric won out on the most spactactular results gained just by moving a pickup.
I have a Strat twelve string I got the best sound out of it by backing the pickups way off and wiring number two and four positions to be humbucking. The results is a very full sounding twelve but it would have overdriven had the pickups been nearer the strings.
So keep up the good work on your Gretsch improvments. I'm eager to hear how and what you come up with.
I liked the EE model due to the 25 scale, the B-7 bigsby provides another further spring bar and it was critical in my choice. Rather than a having a B-5 that would not give the stability effect that the B-7 will I think.
Also the volume control has already been modded to give the same sound even when turned down. I could do that but its already there.
I like having the pickup selector mounted a tad further fowards and I like having the mudswitch. Not only is it very Gretsch looking its also voiced different. I could change caps in another guitar but again its already done.
Then of course there's the locking tuners. I could have added those two but again its more expense, time, and trouble.
It offers everything from overdriven, to clean, to twang. One of the last things is it still looks for the all the world like a Duo Jet.
We guitar players are all crows and want something shiny to take back to the nest.
But other players will prefer different Gretsch guitars for other reasons.
Whats your take on EE and Cavern Jet?

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:27 pm

The EE and Cavern Jet are two great examples of just how the DJ has evolved over the years. The EE has all the latest Gretsch bells and whistles and the green and gold is pretty outrageous in the style department. The pre-modded volume control (the rolloff rate of the master volume control is a constant source of irritation to Gretsch players) and locking tuners are great features.

The CJ is a nice example of the "old" philosophy. It's not as nut-and-bolt true to an original as, say, a 325C58 Rock, which is an historic recreation worthy of any museum, but it does give a feeling of the vintage vibe. The rocking bar bridge is a neat vintage touch (most DJs have the Space Cadet) and Dyna Sonic single coils give it a different (more vintage "Cliff Gallup") sound than the FTs.

My project guitar is about 70% style mods and 30% functional mods. The only "new" features from a functional standpoint are the Sperzels and the modded adjustable Hot Rod FTs. I'm waiting for some small parts to assemble it, but it's 90% completed right now. I'll post links when it's finished.

qmoder · Post by **qmoder** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:22 pm

The hot rod adjustable FT's alone would make yours and interesting guitar.
I plan on getting some powertrons from T.V. after I get mine.
I was for the caddy green at first. Until I saw it in black on the Northcoast site. Its says George too much not to get it. I got my Ric from Gary too and was treated to excellent service. Thats I wanna deal with him again.
I've got a group of black guitars going now. A twelve string almost deceased Strat that my buddy gave me. He got it in a pawn shop. I added surf green knobs and pickguard to it and fixed up the rest of its almost totaled self.
I have mystic black six string Strat that I changed pickups, tone controls, and added cream knobs and cream pearloid pickguard.
Black Turser bass with chrome hardware. I added a silver guard and control panel.
So why not a black Jet with gold pickguard and hardware. Too cool to pass up.
Glad to hear your Jet project is almost complete Paul. That way I get to hear about it soon.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:42 pm

Yeah, Dan, it's hard to see it sitting there waiting for a dozen screws to finish it up. I ordered them in plenty of time, but the dealer lost the order.

I need to install the pickups, finish the pickguard and mount it, redo the peghead logo and bind the peghead and it'll be done. I will probably get 50% of this done this weekend. But I warn you--it is 180 degrees apart from your black Duo Jet! It goes off in a whole new direction for Gretsch solid bodies...

Then I've got a '99 double cut Pro Jet that's getting the outrageous treatment next. Stay tuned.

But of course, there are three Rickenbackers that I'm working on for customers. Going back and forth is what keeps things juicy!

A black DJ with the gold stuff. Awesome. And it's got the single coils, right?