Ric pickups?

[docbass]

Wow, it's amazing how much discusion pickups can inspire! As for placement, I said one close to the neck and the other close to the bridge, actual location is yet to be determined. I have a couple hollow body bsses and will use them as potential models. I don't typically lean toward extremes anyway.

I like the Ric pups because thee string spacing is pretty much right on target. My project has a Fender musicmaster neck and bridge, essentially the spacing is within a fraction of an inch to a 4003. So, string excursion during vibration wouldn't be a problem.

Well, I was just about settled on 2 hi gains when I came across 2 DeArmond USA made humbuckers like they used in their hollow body basses and couldn't resist the retro look, Alnico magnets and adjustment screws for each string. So, I'm giving them a try. If they don't work out, I probably will return to the Rics for my electronics.

Thanks for a great discussion and all of the input. It really was an education for me!!

[rictified]

I haven't read all the posts so I don't know if anyone mentioned this but you also should be careful not to put a pickup right under a node where the overtones reverse themselves, you will get a dead spot, you won't get that particular overtone, or it can be greatly diminished, there was a good article is BP mag a few years ago, I didn't really study it though, but you might want to see if you can get a copy. Thre first node is exactly at one half of the length of the string, then one quarter and so on. You can put your finger right on the first node and stop the fundamental but the first overtone will still be vibrating on either side of the node, if you put a pickup right there, all you would get would be fundamental I believe. There are three nodes for the second overtone (4 quarters). I'm too tired to think anymore but it's logical.

[rictified]

I just read the whole thing and one thing I agree with is that a neck through and a bolt on are completely different animals. The bolt on has less treble and less sustain, more of a thumpy sound, they also feel different to me when I play them. I have one 4001 that I think was refretted somewhere along the line and they did not re-varnish the neck, and it sounds different than all my other rics, it's also got a wooden nut. It's decidely less trebly sounding, and has a little less sustain, it's a more mellow Ric, I think the materials and construction have a real lot to do with the way a bass sounds, solid or hollow.

[ojobob2]

Bob - yes i agree that construction has a huge affect on the sound of a bass - even between different neckthru Ricks. Both my 4001 and 4003 have brand new steel roundwounds on them right now, and if you just pluck around on the strings without plugging them in they sound very different - and this is carried thru to the real amplified sound

My 4001 has a lot of acoutsic twang- whilst the 4003 it more subtle. However due to the overwound pickups on the 4003 - you end up with that ultra fat aggressive tone. As the 4001 has slightly underwound pickups, the sound is far clearer.

Also IMHO , Rickenbacker 4000 series basses sound terrible compared to say a P bass, when played through a small inadequate amp, or plugging into something unappropriate such as a stereo. A P bass tends to sound like a "real bass" even if i use one of those stupid squier 10w practice amps. A Rick thru one of those sounds like a tinny rattley mess

Of course in a real band setting - the Rickenbacker wins hands down!

[jps]

Actually I find that my Jazz Bass has more treble than any of my Ricks. It is definitely brighter sounding. Of course there are other things to consider besides the generalization of neck through vs. bolt-on.

[jwr2]

Yes rics don't work as well through little cheap amps ... a p bass is better thru them ... but use an ampeg svt and the ric shines ...

Yes most jazz basses are brighter than rics ... look at the pickup location ...

The tone control on a passive bass is really only a treble cut control ... With a jazz bass you have to back off the tone control to get a good sound ... whereas with a Ric you can leave tone control wide open ... so you get more overtones when you hit a string ... this is part of the rickenbacker sound ...

Here's a trick ... on your jazz bass turn the volume control for the bridge pickup down and turn the tone up ... your jazz will have more of a Ric tone ...

I have found that most 2 pickup basses sound better when one pickup volume is backed off somewhat ...

[squirebass]

Interesting comment concerning Jazz basses, especially the part about them being brighter than Ricks. While I'd have to go do some serious A/B testing to comment, I do play Jazz basses fairly regularly(I own two, one a fretless) and I have over the years determined that I can get almost any sound out of my Rick that I can get out of a Jazz bass. Usually when I hear someone refer to a Rick bass as a "one trick pony" (usually fender players) I jump right in on that, because I can emulate most any Jazz sound on my v63s

[jwr2]

Take Geddy Lee for example ... He has played a lot of basses ... Ric's, Wal's, Jazz, p-bass, etc ... and he always sounds like Geddy ...

But he always sounds best on a Ric ...

[docbass]

Good points Bob. You got me to thinking about pickup placement and I remembered an article I read a while back and found it again:

http://www.till.com/articles/PickupResponse/index.html

I plan on using it and your suggestions as I experiment with position. My initial plan is to place the pickups temporarily and experiment with the sound I get from them before permanent placement. I realize some of the tonality I get will change once I route for the pups, but I should get a good idea of any deadspots or voids with my method.

[jps]

Most two pickup basses most certainly have a range of tone available unlike one pickup basses such as a P-Bass, of course I am generealizing here. Occasionally I'll use just the neck PU on my Jazz Bass which is a '03 stack knob model that currently has TI flats on it. It has a tendency to be a little too muddy sounding however that way, so I prefer either both PUs or the "Jaco" setting with the neck PU rolled off some.

[rictified]

This is just my opinion Owen and I used to agree with you but I have found that without the cap and with both pickups at approximatly the same output (usually with the treble pickup low down in the casing at a equal distance form the strings) and especially with flatwounds Rics sound just as good if not better in a small amp. The trick for me is that the small amps cannot reproduce the real lows Rics are capable of, and with the cap in place all you get is highs in a small amp, get rid of the cap and you get the low mids that fill in the sound of a Ric.
When I took out the cap in my 79 4001 with Ric stock roundwounds on it, I got a good sound out of a mid 50's 5 watt open back Phillips tube shortwave radio with one 8 inch speaker, I couldn't rattle the walls of course but I got a good full bass sound, before I took out the cap it sounded terrible in that radio (sounded good through my SVT though).

[rictified]

Oh and I'll put a new 4003 against a P bass anytime and get more punch and I also agree that Rics are very versatile, I think much more so than F****rs. I like them but if I could only own one bass it would be a Ric, also I agree that Rics and jazzes can sound very similar, I give the edge to the Ric though, Lima is full of Fenders, Squires, Yamahas, and Ibinezes, and when people see my Rics they usually are VERY impressed and love the sound.

[rickcrazy]

An interesting example of an early 70's 4001 treble high-gain pickup. This one was left unsprayed.

[rickcrazy]

And an early version of the above. The very first version had roundhead screws for polepieces.

[rickcrazy]

A treble high-gain from the mid 80's (courtesy Paul Yan).