Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

Band dynamics are fascinating.

There's a continuum that at one end has the guy who hires a group of players to play exactly what he wants when and where he wants how he wants, and at the other end is an organic group of truly collaborative musicians working together to create something as a unit. Most bands fall somewhere in between, but I suspect many of them are closer to the first that the last. It seems that usually, there is one person in the band who has the vision, and finds other people to help him/her realize that vision. What is really interesting is that in many cases the band leaders have managed to find people to work to achieve their visions for free. That happens, I think, either because the other players are willing to play for free just for the fun of playing, or because they are allowed a certain limited amount of freedom in coming up with arrangements, solos, etc., and that gives them a sufficient outlet for their own artistic musical aspirations.

But I think you should always draw the line when it comes to shelling money out of your pocket to achieve somebody else's artistic goal, and that sounds exactly like what's going on here. From the most recent posts, it is clear that this band is a vanity project for the leader. If you are willing to play for free for the fun of playing, great, but if he has a vision he wants to achieve and it will cost money to achieve it, he should pay that money, especially if it's something that (in his opinion/fear anyway) people won't pay to hear.

Well, you have all just witnessed the end of my first real band experience. The leader booted me out tonight for not being a "team player". Pretty funny and sad. I have had so many conversations with the other band members in the past week, who all agreed with me (and you guys). We were all going to talk with him at this Thursday's practice but he couldn't risk that so he cancelled practice and gave me the boot.

I'm looking forward to seeing if the other band members will really stand up to him or not. If not then I'll end up the bad guy for insubordination, but it was worth it!

Oh well. Other doors will open I'm sure. I really appreciate your advice and I got the same advice from everybody I talked to about this.

-Greg

Well Greg,

He probably did you a favour because you were only wasting your time playing in His band. You'll find something better I am sure and look back on all of this as being just another life experience.

Forget that guy and good riddance, as far as your music goes. He's poison. Glad he didn't fire you after he got your money.

Look at it this way: You got out of a pretty crummy situation with your reputation in tact. You'll do fine. Because the word will get around what a lousy guy this Leader Dude really is.
JimK

You did the right thing, getting fired! Lots of jazz fish in the sea.

Heck no! PA gear, mixer, cables, even a band van or something, but not someone's personal instrument. We are doing a gig and buying some new monitors at a gig in a couple of weeks. I would say emphatic no to this!

I remember one failed band where someone had the bright idea that we should all pay to hire a drumslinger, some pro hotshot, to up our presentation factor (we had none) for a gig playing covers that wasn't going to pay anyway. I objected on a number of levels, paid or not. Another project where the leader didn't have any money but had great songs and the right idea about what we should be about - I was happy to do his album and tour on the cheap . Twenty five years later the album is legend and I finally got paid, with absolutely no hard feelings That's how it goes, but I guess my point is to follow your heart and you'll have no regrets. Your first, simplest impressions of these situations is the way to go. I think all band meetings should be held barefoot in sandboxes at the nearest playground, and disputes should be settled by wrestling each other to the ground and giving noogies.

Barefoot.....in sand boxes.....?? Ewwwwwww think of all that cat pooh!
JimK

jimk wrote:Barefoot.....in sand boxes.....?? Ewwwwwww think of all that cat pooh!
JimK

All right, then, the drummer brings the rake.

Greg, I'm sorry to read what happened. You certainly never deserved that, what a mess!

Look at the bright side, and I'm being serious here: start your own jazz band. It sounds like there's about a dozen or so guys and/or gals who will probably be happy to leave their current project for yours, if you know what I mean*. If you need charts or anything, let me know. Just please don't get discouraged!







*And in case it isn't clear, I mean stealing this jerk's band would be the perfect revenge.

Thanks JDog and all. I do plan to work hard on some of the things I have been putting off as far as learning (reading music, improv techniques, walking, etc.), then be ready to try and get something going. Craigslist is pretty good for finding musicians so I will probably try that or just go by word of mouth or even former band mates.

I am not at all discouraged. I have maintained a very enjoyable relationship with the bass in the three years since I picked it up, and plan to continue that for a long time. It's a great balance to the rest of my life!

-Greg

Just to close this down, I went and picked up my stuff from the studio today. The Leader left it all by the door with a note saying he was too hurt & angry to talk. C'est La Vie. One good thing is the other band members met with him last night and they all got their points across and did not cave in to his thoughts, and they agreed to do many of the things that I laid out in my emails to The Leader, so things are going to change for them. That really makes me happy, as my efforts would have felt a little useless if he held his grip over the rest of them after this episode.

To that's the end of "Greg The Bassist Version 1.0". Looking forward to what the next iteration will be and I've already started working on it!

Again, thanks for the fantastic info through this process.

-Greg

You gotta kiss a lot of frogs before you find your prince, Greg, but you've got the right attitude and I predict success for your musical life. Good luck and keep on rocking!

I think I am up to v12.4.6.2.8