Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

"I have no issues with someone bidding against me.....if someone is willing to pay more than me than they deserve it more. No biggie."

I couldn't agree more.

IMHO, the auction should run its course and he who wants it most gets it.

Suppose I had emailed Ken and found out that his max bid was $3500.00. Maybe I would have thought about it for a while and decided that I was willing to pay $3700.00(and this could have happened if the seller had ever returned my emails!) Then what happens? Is Ken then required by the unwritten rules of the Forum to back down? How would Ken know whether or not I was bluffing?

I placed the first bid on this auction. It wasn't a very serious bid, but does that give me dibs and all others must stay away? I don't think so.

What about the sellers rights? If we all consult each other about an auction and agree to stay away from competitive bidding on it, aren't we then guilty of conspiring to fix the price on the auction? How would any of you feel if you wanted to sell something valuable via public auction and you knew that the price had been kept artificially low by a group of potential bidders who got together, discussed who wanted it "most" and then the rest didn't bid?

And how would we decide who wants it "most?"

Jeff. Just so we understand where I'm coming from with this.

I'm really only talking about sharing my intent to seriously bid on an item here, not how much I'm prepared to pay for it. I already know how much I want to spend, and that's how much my max bid will be set at. If someone wants to pay more, they get it. My bid would remain confidential though, and I only ever bid in the last seconds of an auction.

I'm just looking at giving a courtesy shout out to other forumites that I'm in the race, to avoid any hard feelings later.

As for this bass, it wasn't exactly what I wanted, and I got the impression that Ken wanted it more than me, so it made sense to withdraw rather than let my bid push the price up.

I'll see "my" 72 out there one day.

Ken just did wrestle you for it, Gareth. And you quit.

"I'm not in the business of stealing guitars from under the noses of other forum users. I want a checkerboard 4001, but there will be others."

And every time one comes up on ebay there will be forum users other than yourself who want it. Does that mean that you are going to back down every time?

I'm not trying to pick on you Gareth, I'm just trying to have a discussion and make my point.

Even if we discuss our potential desire, and willingness to pay it does not preclude non-forum bidders from increasing the price.

We all saw the shill bids that appeared on the 4005 in the UK recently, in the end the Forum members who were interested stepped aside.

It does not stop any of us who see a can't resist BIN, (either great price, or must have Ric), and go for it, I got my v63 this way.

I agree with Gareth's 'Courtesy shout out" it at least lets us all know who's got an iron in the fire. I don't think as a group we conspire to keep prices low, I think it's more we've a better idea as to what may be a fair price.

I think the major issue sometimes is we stick a bidding toe in the water and go from there. I don't bid on anything I seriously don't want. If I do want it I watch it like a hawk, and bid accordingly.

Okay Gareth...some of my questions were answered by your post that was written at the same time as my post!

Oops!

I guess the problem I see with the above scenario that you just painted is...Suppose you gave Ken the "courtesy shout out" without revealing your max bid. Suppose Ken then backed down. What if your "serious max bid" were $2600.00. You wouldn't have known that Ken's max was $3500.00. Then some if non-forum member came along and bid $2700.00 neither you nor Ken would have ended up with it.

This might make Ken angry!

If you guys really want and can afford the bass you desire, you'll eventually find it. Sometimes your patience pays off and you find an excellent deal like I did two years ago, this '73 with checkered binding for $595 on ebay:


Recently, after over 2 years of looking, I was about to give up hope on finding an output jackplate for my '75 fretless...then Jeff Thomas gave me a spare that he had. I managed to wire it up in time to get it to the SoCal confluence...then since it was being displayed in it's case on the floor, instead of a stand, I forgot to take a picture of it because I was just so mesmerized by everybody else's Rick.

There's enough nice Ricks for us all, just be patient.

Hey Brian I found this under the thread entitled " anyone going to snipe me"seems as though your views have changed in a month "I'm not planning on getting into a bidding war so if someone plans to bid more than me there is no use driving up the price. I'm not looking to pay too much more than the $1k opening bid so let me know. I would like to score this as it would be a great addition to my LK."

How so Ken?

I didn't give my exact amount.....I think I ended up around $1175 (which I would define as not much more than $1K.....my final bid was $1200 and some change). It would be hard to overbid me by $1 since I wasn't exact and I'd see no reason for shill bidding since the opening bid was $1k and I said I wasn't going much higher. Seems pretty consistent with my last posting unless I missed your point......and am I running for President?!?! What other dreadful info will you dig up from my sordid past?

BTW....a month is a lifetime.....my opinions can change by the minute .

I do somewhat agree with the "price fixing" argument. BUT.....while I feel it is a negative for the seller I have no moral issue with helping a forum friend pay less for an item by simply not bidding myself. Would I back out of buying something I really wanted because another forum member expresses interest? No.....but there is no harm in mentioning that I'm interested as well. Would I not bid on a Ric that I want only because it is a good deal when somebody else who maybe has less resources than me really desires it? Sure.....because it isn't that important to me anyway.

What we were talking of is informing other forum members [as you did] of your intent and not waiting the last 8 seconds to snipe it from a fellow member as was the whole issue.If no-one cares i will snipe every body [forum member or not]at the last minute.there are going to be some ****** off people around here.

Sniping is a non-issue to me. I put in my max bid sometime during the auction so if you want to wait until the last second to put yours in go ahead (or have a snipe service do it for you).....if it is not more than mine than it won't do you any good and if it is more then you wanted it more (or just have more $$$$$).

Snipe away!

Besides....I don't have the interest, time and/or energy to be "p-o'd" over losing a silly auction for something I don't really "need" anyway. I have more important things that require my anger at this point in my life.

This is an interesting debate and I can see all sides of the argument. As Joey sagely put it there are enough Rics for all of us and we just have to be patient.

Until last night I was all set to have a very serious stab at the FG 3000 on the ‘bay. The way I bid is waiting till the last minute and place my max bid. If I win it, cool, if not, there will be another bass on another day.

I know of a forum member who is interested in the 3000 and realised that I may have hacked him off if I won the bass, but I would have no problem if someone did the same to me. I guess I feel there is a what will be will be kind of karma.

I don’t think any of us truly need another bass, so I don’t quite get the anger that some seem to feel.

I think that some people feel that it is their right to get a really nice bass at a very good price. Why should this be? If one really wants a decent ’72, then they pop up at fairly regular intervals. If one’s max bid is 2K then chances are you will nearly always miss out on it. If one’s max bid is 3K then chances are you will nearly always win it. It’s just supply and demand and current market value.

If my max was say 2.5K and I was outbid by a forum member by $25, then that’s OK with me. If I really, really wanted that bass I would have bid a lot more than 2.5K in the first place.

See i always backed off when i saw someone bidding hard on a bass,to me its like stepping on toes,then to wait til the last 7[to be exact] seconds and go hog wild raising the bid $400.00 in more then one bid is not excusable .Enough said the subject makes me really angry and being its over with DROP IT!

Ken,

What I just wrote was in no way meant to be inflammatory to how you felt about this recent auction. It was just my take on Ebay auctions re forum members, and not a personal dig.

I love the look of your new ’72 and think you got it for a good price. In five years time it will be worth a great deal more and will have given you much pleasure in the mean time.

Best wishes, Bob

Ken-if you aren't happy that you paid $2800.00 for your new bass, then you shouldn't have bid $3500.00 for it.

I have a degree in economics. I buy and sell financial securities all day long in an open auction environment. I'm not telling you this to blow steam up my @$$, and I don't think that I'm smarter than anyone else here. I may not get it right every time, but I have years of training on how to buy and sell stuff, and I will continue to handle my auctions the way I do.

There are good reasons to wait until the end of the auction to put in your best bid. Competing bidders(and the seller) can get clues about what you like to buy, how much you are willing to spend, and how you like to bid by looking at your previous auctions. Competing bidders might then decide: "hmmm, this guy is willing to pay X dollars for this item and he seems to know the item well. I'll bid X + $100." Or the seller might decide: "hmmm I see that this guy likes to put out a high bid on his auctions and leave it for the duration of the auction. I'll call my buddies and have them place some shill bids."

The only way to keep this from happening is to not give them enough time to do it.

Sorry to "step on your toes." What about my toes? I was the first bidder on the auction, and I am a forum member. Why did you have to go and outbid me on an item that I saw first, and I showed my interest in first?

Damn,this never ends,First, of all Jeff I didn't see your bid I saw the EMP.S BID. Second, I didn't know your user ID.Third, you never met the reserve and fourth,I was going to bid on a certain fireglo c64 but i read that some forum member wanted it bad[was that you?]cause when i checked the auction i saw your user ID,i still didn't know who it was forum member or not i stayed clear.THE ONLY THING YOU DID IS RUN UP THE BID $400.00 ON THE AUCTION IN 7 SECONDS AND ENDED UP WITH NOTHING.seems very stupid to me,why not just bid $4000.00 at the last second you would have won?????If you check my profile i buy and sell cars,i go to the auto auctions three times a week,WE DO NOT DO THIS TO ONE ANOTHER THERE,OTHERWISE THERE WOULD BE FIGHTS BREAKING OUT ALL OVER,AND FURTHERMORE ITS A MATTER OF "RESPECT".