Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

Here is a question for the finish experts.

When you receive a brand new Rickenbacker from the factory, should you wait a certain period of time before you polish or wax its finish? Or, are they safe to polish or wax right away after they leave the factory?

Sorry I can't answer your question but did you get a new Rickenbacker Peter?

No Patrick I didn't, but thanks for asking.

I'm sure that John Hall has his own answer for this, so mine will be presented in the light of personal preference.

At the factory, the conversion varnish finish that covers all new Ricks (and has since 1959, although formulas have improved over the years) is allowed to cure for several days before being carefully hand-wet-sanded and then buffed by hand and stationary machine to a near-perfect gloss using very pricey German abrasives. The wet-sanding, Peter, BTW, relates directly to your observation to me that these guitars are finished more like cars than furniture.

When both my new MB guitars arrived at my door, I of course went nuts over how gorgeous they were, played them until my fingers bled, etc.

Time always comes to cast a more critical eye. I did so in a very bright light and noticed that both guitars had buffing swirls in the clearcoat. I should point out that you really had to look closely to see this.

With my experimental hat on, I did the Scratch-X application, using a soft recycled cloth diaper. The results were fast and dramatic, at least to my eye, and I've shared this with the Forum members. Since all abrasives "open up" a clearcoat finish, it must then be protected. So out came the Zymol.

In keeping with the nature of clearcoat finishes, I do not believe I've done any damage to either of my guitars. Here's why: Because both were purchased from dealer's stock, one was 4 months old at the time I received it, the other 9. So in each case the finish had had some time to age.

What I will point out about Zymol is that it gives superior shine but will eventually oxidize or "burn off". This is not detrimental to the finish of the guitar, in fact, will give it periods to breathe. But it should be renewed a couple of times a year for best protection, even if it stays in the case between uses. You can tell it needs renewing because the finish will show microscopic "halo" rings under bright light.

Paul: Thanks for your comments. I am wondering what the time frame is before the conversion varish dries completely.

I notice, in the case of my 2003 Rickenbacker, that I can still smell the finish more than a year later.

Recently when I had my some minor work done on my 360 V, the TRC had to be removed to make a rod adjustment and a very small portion of the white off the back of the TRC was stuck to the finish. Could this have been from the conversion finish not drying enough? It's hardly noticeable with the TRC back in place but it was the only assumption myself and the luthier could come up with. I too would like to know the drying 'period'.

Wow. I had typed up another detailed answer on this thread and somehow it didn't post. I think I hit the wrong button. Here goes again:

Peter:

Conversion varnish, strictly speaking, does not "dry". It "cures", being a reactive material. The only drying that takes place is right after spraying, when the solvents evaporate into the atmosphere. The varnish used on Rickenbackers takes a couple of days to cure hard enough to wet-sand and power-buff. Typically, the staff at Rick will wait 5-6 days just to give it a margin of safety.

Smelling the finish much later should be a product of two things: how much case time it spends (and many of our guitars spend 95% of their time in the case), and whether a semi-hollow or solid body. The semis still store fumes inside the body and continue to degas through the unfinished back of the wood surface (especially tops and backs) for some time. On solid bodies, there is nowhere for the fumes to go but outward. Guitars kept in the open air will lose the smell much quicker than those kept in the case.

Stan, the TRC paint transfer is more likely due to a combination of the TRC paint being a bit soft when it was installed, and the screws being a bit too snug,

Conversion varnish cross-links, taking months to achieve full film strength, although probably in excess of 95% is there by the time the guitar ships. Once the plasticizers oxidize--which takes a very long time, but can be hastened by environmental factors, the finish can dull or check. However, this is not the only cause of checking. The main cause is thermal shock.

Paul knows more about these things than I do and I like his explanation. I'll only add that for our purposes, they're completely dry within 7 days but more dry time never hurts anything.

Now I know 'curing' or 'drying' time it brings up a another question. From start to finish, (and this may have been brought up before, so forgive me) how long does it take a new model to go from the factory to shipping? Do some models take longer than others?

Yes, it does depends entirely on the model but the average is more like six weeks. We can theoretically do a 650 Series oil-finish guitar in 3 days (we don't though) but a 381 takes many weeks.