Refretting a 4001

rob · Post by **rob** » Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:50 pm

My 4001 has been played hard by it's past owner(s) and has worn down frets. Now, the bass is still quite playable, but I do know in the future, a refret will be needed.

My question is this:
How much more difficult is it to have a refret done on this bass? By the looks of it, it looks quite more difficult than, say, a Fender bass. The binding on mine seems to "overlap" the ends of all the frets, and there seems to be a finish on the fretboard (polyurethane?) that I would assume would crack and/or chip away when the frets are pulled. Of course, there wouldn't be this problem on the above said Fender bass, therefore I would also assume it would cost me more money for the extra work involved. So, when the time comes to refret, how should I go about it? I certainly wouldn't want any luthier who knows only Fender/Gibson/whatever else to handle my problem. Of course, I do not wish to insult any local luthier's professional knowledge at all, but I just don't believe any of them in my area knows much at all about Rickenbacker. (I know I may sound a bit biased here, but whenever I talk to any musicians and luthiers around here, they seem to be thinking Rickenbacker as "foreign". Or maybe I'm not talking to the right people.)

So, maybe I should also ask another question:
Is there anyone who knows a luthier in the Buffalo, NY area who has done work on Rickenbackers? I might need some professional help on my pride an joy in the future.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 4:00 am

Robert, Most all experienced/compitent repairmen can handle this type of work. It will cost on an average of $200.00/$300.00 provided a refret is all that's needed. If done properly the finish and finger board will turn out fine. If the board needs refinished because of previous wear, this is the time to do it. As for the area you live in, check with your local musicians, the ones who play 5/6 nights a week. they can steer you in the direction of a good repair shop. I hope this helps you.

rob · Post by **rob** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:50 am

But, how about the binding overlapping the ends of the frets? Would I need to get new binding to replace the old, because most likely it might get destroyed when the old frets are pulled?

rick12dr · Post by **rick12dr** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:24 am

With a refret, you lose the binding overlap on fret ends.This is Not a big deal, unless you are really anal about it, in which case, you Might find someone who knows how to remedy this. Rebinding the fingerboard edge is a waste of extra $$ spent, IMO. Anyone else care to comment on this one?FWIW, for all the refrets I've ever done on Ricks ,not one person has Ever requested this of me.

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:47 am

With any kind of care, the binding will be preserved- it's not that hard to do it right, as Dale suggests.

On the other hand, it's a good chance to have the fret undercut so it extends over the binding a bit, for some extra playing room. Not as useful on a bass perhaps but still worth considering.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:22 pm

One of mine was refretted sometime before I bought it and the ends of the frets stick out a little beyond the binding. They took all the finish off the neck also and never reapplied it, it still plays and sounds good though. It actually needs another refret.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 6:17 pm

I'm with you Don and John Hall. This is the best advice you will get from CEO to Repairmen. I've always done the same, pull the frets and level the finger board, you lose the binding nub, but it's not needed anyway. And John makes an excellent point, in saying that you'll have that little extra bit of fret overlapping the binding.

rob · Post by **rob** » Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:46 pm

Well, that's good to know. I didn't know whether or not taking of the frets would do any damage to the binding. I know if I pulled them out, I'd probably screw the binding up. Not having the binding overlap is not a real concern to me, as much as an extra expense of replacing binding.

As for now, it can wait a while. I just want to do some homework, so when the time comes I know what I'm going in with.

david_schwab · Post by **david_schwab** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 10:29 am

I've done refrets with binding both ways.... one way is to remove the binding, make the fret ends flush with the board, and rebind. It's a lot of work! The binding tends to shrink after it's removed.

The alternative that I usually use is to notch the fret ends to sit over the binding. And as John said, it gives you a little extra width. StewMac sells a cool fret tang nipper that does the trick nicely.

John (or anyone else who might know).. this might have been discussed already, but for someone who wants to refret a 4001 using wire as close to the original... what size is it? Assuming that RIC doesn't sell fret wire, what is the closest match?

It looks sort of like "standard" (i.e., non jumbo) wire, but I haven't compared. I refretted mine with jumbo some years back and want to restore the bass to as close as stock as possible.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:45 pm

Here are the entire measurements of the fret wire from a mid 70's Rick Bass that I just recently refretted. These were taken from a Dial Caliper. Width: .100 Height: .050 these are the measurements of the fret part that sits on the finger board. Tang width: .030
Total Height of the Fret including the Tang: .095

325_fan · Post by **325_fan** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 1:39 am

I've refretted one, but I also removed the old fingerboard and binding which made it uber easy. I bought the frets from Stewart McDonald glued and hammered the frets in by hand.

david_schwab · Post by **david_schwab** » Wed Oct 19, 2005 6:35 am

Thanks Dale!

Chris, you removed the fingerboard? Was something wrong with it? Sounds like a lot of work for a refret!

325_fan · Post by **325_fan** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:50 am

Yeah, I know this dude in a machine shop. I didn't like the rosewood fingerboard with the triangular inlays so I had him jig it up and mill the old fingerboard off. I purchased a pre-slotted fingerboard from Exotic Woods and Gulab Guidwani. I glued the fingerboard on the neck and it turned out great.

rob · Post by **rob** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 6:06 am

You had the fingerboard milled off? I haven't heard of that way of removing a fingerboard yet, until now. I would just assume to do it the old fashioned way, in which I believe to use heat to loosen the glue between the fretboard and neck.

325_fan · Post by **325_fan** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 6:28 am

I wanted to save a thin veneer of rosewood between the maple neck and the new ebony fingerboard because the thickness of the new fingerboard was thinner than the old one. The procedure was tricky at best. We exacted the linear profile and articulated it by making a jig which supported the back of the guitar and the neck. The result was a fingerboard with the same relief and radius as the old one. I didn't want to have to do anything with the bridge assembly, eg.; spacers, shims, etc.