Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

So after gluing the binding back on to my 68 4001 fireflo, a little of the glue got on to the finish of the bass and there's this nice swirl on the finish.

Anyone run into this? thoughts on getting it out?

Thanks!

This stuff sticks like, erm, glue, onto conversion varnish.

You need to sand it off, buff the area, and wax it.

SAND using a small (1" X 1/2" or so) HARD block--I useblocks made of 1/8" thick plexiglas, but one of wood will work, too. But it must be small, as the smaller the area you dull and flatten by sanding, the less area you'll have to buff back to a mirror shine.

Use #1000 Wet or Dry sandpaper, wetted down with a 50/50 mixture of Windex and water, or a soapy water solution. 1000 can be found at larger hardware and home centers, or your local paint store. Don't use anything coarser--it will scratch or could even wear the varnish down to the maple.

Sand the glued area flat with the surrounding varnish.

WAIT a couple of days to allow the sanded area to de-gas. The super glue softens the varnish, and allowing it to harden again after it's been sanded back will give a better shine.

RUB with a good fine white liquid polishing compound--a paste compound is too aggressive. Best is 3M Perfect-It III or Perfect-It 3000 (TRAK Auto, etc, available in 8 oz. bottles). Use a soft cotton cloth or diaper. Synthetics scratch.

RUB AGAIN with Meguiar's Swirl-X (formerly Scratch-X)

WAX with Zymol Cleaner Wax (light blue plastic bottle).

It should be noted that if you have to buy all the stuff noted here, you won't get much change back from $40.00...this could be an expensive lesson, but he same materials can be used to keep your Rick and other instruments in prime condition for years to come.

HI Mr. Jangle, I use superglue for everything. What are your thoughts on a q-tip with a drop of nail polish remover rather than the sandpaper?

I haven't had a lot of success using acetone (nail polish remover) to remove superglue from anything but my fingers. Acetone does not dissolve conversion varnish, but it does soften it, and the longer it remains in contact with CV, the more it penetrates the CV layer. If a piece of wood finished with CV is actually put into a tray of acetone to soak, within hours the acetone will penetrate the CV to its full thickness, cuasing it to soften and swell, and eventually it will wrinkle dramatically and slough from the substrate.

Yikes.

In other words, i was lucky! Thanks!

Acetone will soften cyanoacrylate glues somewhat. Nitromethane is a better solvent and methylene chloride is even better. I have no idea what those would do to CV however.

How do you keep nitromethane wetting the surface long enough to evaluate any results?

I bought a case of 24 8 ounce brown glass bottles of nitromethane from a supplier, about ten years ago. It sat, unopened, in storage, for five years. The bottles were sealed with bakelite closures and taped around the seam with vinyl tape to further seal them.

When I opened the case and inspected the bottles they were half empty. Just pouring his stuff into another container caused half of what was left to evaporate.

Methylene chloride has a similar effect on CV to acetone. So does ethylene dichloride.

Actually, the stuff we used to use was Loctite 768 X-NMS Solvent, which, according to the MSDS is a blend of nitromethane and toluene. We'd occasionally have to break out the methylene chloride, but that stuff is nasty and rather toxic...

Whew, this thread is making me woozy. Where's my vapor mask?

I'll bore everyone with a grad school story about nitromethane.

Nitromethane is commonly used in organic synthesis when a polar aprotic solvent is needed. The fellow grad student that I shared the lab with needed to use nitromethane in one of his syntheses, and it had to be absolutely dry (no water at all). So he set up a distillation inside a fume hood according to a literature method for obtaining dry nitromethane; this procedure included the use of activated molecular sieve (size 5A, IIRC) in the receiving flask as an additional guarantee that even the lowest traces of water would be removed.

My colleague and one of the post-docs began distilling it with the hood sash closed. After about 5-10 mL of the pure nitromethane had distilled over, they noticed that the liquid distilling over was pale yellow, but down in the receiving flask with the molecular sieve, it was a a light reddish-brown. They decided something was wrong and had just turned the heating off when there was a loud POW! with the sound of breaking glass. The receiving flask had exploded into many pieces. The hood sash, being down, kept any fragments from escaping from the hood. Neither of my colleagues was hurt, just a little shaken (as was I!) by the unexpected explosion.

After doing some more literature searching, we concluded that, most likely, some size 13A molecular sieve had gotten mixed in with the 5A (we recycled this material, as it wasn't that cheap and it was fully recyclable). The larger pore size of the 13A sieve could have allowed the nitromethane molecules to enter the pores where catalytic decomposition could occur, and the decomposition products (possibly including diazomethane) were probably shock-sensitive and caused the explosion.

Chemistry is so much fun!

cjj wrote:Actually, the stuff we used to use was Loctite 768 X-NMS Solvent, which, according to the MSDS is a blend of nitromethane and toluene. We'd occasionally have to break out the methylene chloride, but that stuff is nasty and rather toxic...

Like toluene isn't?!

doctorwho wrote:I'll bore everyone with a grad school story about nitromethane.

Nitromethane is commonly used in organic synthesis when a polar aprotic solvent is needed. The fellow grad student that I shared the lab with needed to use nitromethane in one of his syntheses, and it had to be absolutely dry (no water at all). So he set up a distillation inside a fume hood according to a literature method for obtaining dry nitromethane; this procedure included the use of activated molecular sieve (size 5A, IIRC) in the receiving flask as an additional guarantee that even the lowest traces of water would be removed.

My colleague and one of the post-docs began distilling it with the hood sash closed. After about 5-10 mL of the pure nitromethane had distilled over, they noticed that the liquid distilling over was pale yellow, but down in the receiving flask with the molecular sieve, it was a a light reddish-brown. They decided something was wrong and had just turned the heating off when there was a loud POW! with the sound of breaking glass. The receiving flask had exploded into many pieces. The hood sash, being down, kept any fragments from escaping from the hood. Neither of my colleagues was hurt, just a little shaken (as was I!) by the unexpected explosion.

After doing some more literature searching, we concluded that, most likely, some size 13A molecular sieve had gotten mixed in with the 5A (we recycled this material, as it wasn't that cheap and it was fully recyclable). The larger pore size of the 13A sieve could have allowed the nitromethane molecules to enter the pores where catalytic decomposition could occur, and the decomposition products (possibly including diazomethane) were probably shock-sensitive and caused the explosion.

Chemistry is so much fun!

Other than the BOOM, that pretty much flew right over my head! I did enjoy though.

Wow! Just finished this today and I've gotta say- The Scratch-x + Zymol is an amazing combination! This ric looks better then it ever has! I'll post pics soon!

Thanks so much for the help!!

Yeah..... I know all about that sort of stuff, Doc....... NOT!!

Glad you got a good result Kevin. I used the treatment last night on a Sienna Burst Ash Strat I just picked up and it's come up a treat!!

ozover50 wrote:Yeah..... I know all about that sort of stuff, Doc....... NOT!!

You too, huh?