Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

Hi everyone. I just put a question on the RIC bass line in the fretted section. I am interested in the difference or restrictions of fretless as I've never seen them before. Can and are they suitable for all styles, or limited to flatwound jazz moods alone? Looks alone, fretless very nice. Thanks for any feedback, and if others play other makes to Rickenbacker, I'm interested to learn how they go against the ever present P, J and PJ bass guitars. Cheers!

as a newcomer to fretless (after playing fretted for 30-plus years),i say go for it! i just bought my first real fretless bass a few weeks ago,and am really enjoying it. i am basically a pop/rock,player,not at all proficient at jazz. fretless isn't just about jaco and fusion,altho they are associated with it often. think of andy fraser (free) or even sting's playing in the police. fl is quite versatile,i jammed last night on some pretty hairy loud cream-type music and was really digging the sound i was getting. if you are new to bass,it's all going to be a learning experience,just make sure to have your bass properly set up to begin with. also,i was hedging my bets a bit,i purchased a very inexpensive yamaha fl to start,but it has proved to be a really nice little bass for $150! (i have played a lot of expensive basses over the years,too!)

I have a few FL basses, including a J, a P, a 4001 and a 4003. I've used them successfully in many genres of music; from jazz to bluegrass to prog to metal. In general, their tone is similar to a fretted sibling, but the most noticeable thing missing is clank (understandably, as clank comes from frets). So, to the extent that clank is integral to the sound of a bass, then the FL versions diverge somewhat (not stating good or bad here, just how much the tone differs). I would say that clank is somewhat integral to the sound of the 4001, the 4003 and the J, but not so much the P. So if you absolutely love clank as a major part of your technique, then FL may not be so good for you.

Otherwise, the nice features of FL include:

1. A generally rounder sound with more wood tone to it;
2. The ability to play any pitch you want (which can either be liberating or result in horribly-intonated notes that will make all the dogs and cats in your neighborhood hate you );
3. You'll never pay for a re-fret;

Of course, some folks avoid the use of round-wounds on FL. With varnished boards such as on a Rick, I've found that rounds will chew into the finish quite quickly. Not so much of a problem on ebony or harder rosewood boards.

Lastly, the loss of clank can be replaced by clack on FL. Clack is clank's cousin; manifested by string contact with the fingerboard; generally at the end of the board. So, FL can require some modification to both left and right hand technique. Just a few thoughts.

The only two reservations I would have with starting on a fretless are:

- The intonation challenge - it is so much easier to "sound right" from day 1 with a fretted bass.
- The relative limited availability of fretless basses.

If you're patient and can live with the extended learning cycle, go for it!

I play both fretted and fretless basses and view the two as distinctly different instruments. In fact, that's what I love about them: the difference allows me to play each instrument for its unique sound quality. When I know in my head what sound I want for a particular song/tune/genre, that's when I know to reach for my fretted or fretless.

I, too, would warn that if you do not already know something about the unique qualities, you may be jumping the gun by going directly to a fretless. I don't want to dissuade you, but as a beginner, you may do better to learn on a fretted instrument and discover/develop the sound you want to achieve, then move into a fretless. This, of course, is merely practical advise. If a fretless sound is what you want right away, go for the fretless - you'll learn how to play it! Some of us even learned how to play the double bass before the electric (in school orchestras, probably!).

By the way, I have a 4003FL, a 4003, and a 4004Cii. Each one has a unique voice, and each one inspires me and brings out a different approach to playing. I am amazed at how versatile the 4003FL is - you really can get the classic RIC sound, plus you can sound like the biggest wooden upright imaginable. And everything in-between!

Welcome to the forum, Kenneth!

rickenbrother wrote:Welcome to the forum, Kenneth!

+1!

We need to see some pictures of those lovelies of yours!

Yes, it is an option. But you can't just grab it like a fretted fencepost and dive in. If you're going fretless first time out, you will need classical upright bass lessons to learn positions and how to find the notes properly, and more especially, navigate from note to note without the frets. You can be off as much as 1 1/2 inches, the comfortable space between the lower frets, and the fret will still take care of you. If you're off a fretless by 1/8 inch, intonation will suffer, and suffer more as you go up the neck.

But--it's worth it to find your own voice.

afraid i have to disagree a bit with your first statement,there,as that's pretty much exactly what i did with my new venture into fretless. of course, i am not playing classical or jazz music with it,but have found it pretty easy to tell by ear when my fingers are in the wrong place!
the original poster is new to bass,but i believe has played guitar before,so it shouldn't be too hard to make the transistion-i have a friend who is a guitarist,he bought his first bass, a fretless MIM jazz and has been doing really well with it. i am not even sure after 30 years of playing bg myself,that my hand positions are "correct"....

Welcome Kenneth,

I also recently (last month) purchased my first fretless after 40 years of playing only fretted instruments, and am also having a blast learning real intonation.

I found fretless very simple to pick up... but I had some jazz training in college which probably helped a bit.

First time I remember playing a fretless was at a blues gig where I was in the house band, and a guy showed up with a fretless Steinberger during the second of three sets (the "jam" set). He said something like, "Ya gotta have balls to play fretless." I took it as a challenge and played his bass for the final set of that evening. It was so natural, I don't remember hitting a single sour note.

I had to learn on a fretless, and I really really believe that having to get it "right" on the fretboard, and hearing the difference in tone made me into a better player. Although my first few gigs, whoa, bumnote central. They say you learn by your mistakes though, teehee!

Fretless as a first bass?
It's really no different to trying your first guitar with a slide.
Not hard per se, just a different challenge.

It's all gonn depend on the tones you're trying to get too.
If you're chasing a real "mwah" kind of sound, a super low action with round wounds will get that in spades.

Sometimes a person's first instrument is a violin, cello, or double bass. So a first bass guitar being fretless is not a bad choice for an apiring bassist.

One thing that is cool with fretless is setting up a neck with shellac and using round wounds. I've got a 2nd hand Jazz Bass with a fretless neck that was coated by HG Thor (http://www.woodwiz.com/epoxy/) and it is nothing short of spectacular. It has a bright saw blade intonation to it that will literally seem to be singing when you get on it. You can of course play a fretless with roundwounds without a coated neck, but you won't get the same tones and you'll be digging a hole to your thumb in no time.