Rickresource Rickenbacker Forum

The Zzzzzzz thread got me thinking about the complaints that RIC does not create new models.

How many of you bassists out there who own some variant of the venerable 4000 series basses (4000, 4001, 4003 and their derivatives, sorry to those 4002 owners, those are fairly unique unto themselves) own some variant of the "new" 4004 series of basses? The 4004 basses were introduced around 20 years ago or so, hardly making them "new models", but how many of you actually own one or more? To those who have not owned or played them, can you really say there is nothing new/different being made by RIC, just the 'same old' 4003-like basses? The only things similar between the 4004 and other models are the silhouette and depending on model year, the neck feel, essentially. Otherwise, they are a totally "new" and different bass.

Let the polling begin!

I own one, but to be fair it's probably only because it's modified. So I might fall best in the "tried one" camp, if a modified example doesn't count. I've tried around a dozen or more 4004s (mostly stock, but some other modified examples) over the last few years. Almost all, except for the one I own, were Ciis. Mine is a Laredo.

What kept me away for the longest time was the aesthetic (not a fan of the brass hardware on the Cii) and the way the neck profiles varied like crazy (far more than 4003s from the same time period). The neck pickup position seemed iffy as well although in practice it's really quite useable. Although I really didn't have a problem with the 4004 I could never find one I truly loved until this last one, which is a pretty convincing Ric-Precision hybrid neck.

4003s are hard enough for the average player to find in a store, let alone a 4004. Which is why I suspect the 4004 remains largely "undiscovered" (but not really).

4004s have also changed so much over the years, especially the neck profile and to a lesser extent the pickup positions. It makes it disorienting to consider tracking down and purchasing "a good one", especially for new players. A Jazz Bass is always basically a Jazz Bass on the exterior which breeds enough comfort, familiarity and acceptance (even if there's a funky S-1 switch or graphite neck stabilizing rods) for players to track one down they like. I don't think the 4004 has had that luxury for most of its existence.

It would be cool to see the 4004 become as widely known and sold as the 4003 and really go toe-to-toe with it as now that I have one in my arsenal I know they are capable of being really, really good basses.

No secret that the 4004 series are my favorite bass guitars.

They sound great, have a wide range of tones. I can never understand anyone who can't get a 4001/3 type of treble clank out of one. I can with mine.
I like the way they respond like no other bass guitar I've tried by changing how the strings are plucked/attacked. Tony C agrees with me on that.
They are nice and light. With a comfy wide strap, I can play a 3 to 4 set gig without the slightest shoulder fatigue.
I love how I can control the volume with one knob.

I my opinion, modifications for convenience would be; a quick hook bridge and instead of the pickup selector switch, a pan pot to control the output level between the pickups. That pan pot could also be push/pull to change the pickups from humbuckers to single coils and back. That would still leave control over total volume output as well as tone control each to one pot. A third pickup right near the bridge like a 4002 or 4004LK would be nice in the 4004s that have the pickups in the configuration towards the neck.

I found out about 4004's only 7 years ago,when i found this website. I loved the stripped- down-to- essential esthetic look of them before i ever saw one in person. I had owned a 4002 for a decade at that point and while i loved it,i did not love the feel of the binding on either the body or the neck.i decided then and there i had to have one,once i started asking here about them,there were a number of somewhat confusing facts to choose from,Laredos and Cheyennes I and II,different pickup positions,etc. I sold my 4002 to a former forum member (for $2k!),and found a very nice mapleglo Cii from "the Rick Page". It had the offset pickup positions i preferred. When it arrived,i absolutely loved the it,and it is still my favorite of my 3 Ricks. It has been tweaked with new electronics to brighten the sound.So,i also like the basic package,but find some "room for improvement",at least for my preferences. I had to swap the gold bling for chrome,too,i love gold on every other color but not on mapleglo.

I digress a bit here,i have another well-known highly modded Laredo which i love too. I would love to own both an 8 string Laredo,and a fretless 4 string Cii,should I ever win a lottery. For me,the 4004 is the best bass out there. And if my '74 4000 is listening,"don't Worry,I still love you too,ya little Oddball!" ( again,after a bit of modding) While i can appreciate the fantastic looks of RIC's recent 4003 offerings,as well as the vintage look of pre-'72 4001's, i don't have any desire to own one. ( well-maybe an RM type!)
Murra Krimma!

Had a 2012 Cii briefly and loved the aesthetics but really couldn't get into the sound. It was far too dark through my MarkBass/Barefaced rig and no matter what I did with EQing I couldn't get the Ric Edge I was looking for. I did consider fitting one of Dane's harnesses but in the end I decided to let it go in favour of a 4003. It's a shame really, I think there were 3 of us (on the UK forum I frequent) that got 4004s around the same time and I know at least 2 of us let them go because of the stock voicing.

It took me a while to decide I liked the looks of the 4004. I was (and still am) a big fan of the binding and triangle fret markers. The plain, simple look of the 4004 just didn't get me excited. But them I saw one whose flame really grabbed me, so I figured, "what the heck."

After getting it, I have to say I was converted, I really do love the feel (though I still love my 4001 & 4003 basses). I didn't really like the 2-knob setup and lack of Rick-O-Sound since I generally run everything with separate amps/settings for the two pickups. So, I modified mine to have stacked knobs, with separate volume and tone for each pickup. I also added stereo, with a selector switch to go mono if necessary. And then I added switches to split the coils for single coil sounds, and a couple more switches to add in the in-line cap, for each pickup. Yeah, that's a bit of overkill. The in-line caps don't seem all that useful, but I like the coil split.

I've wanted to add a 3rd pickup too, just haven't had time to do it. When I do, I'll simplify things, probably won't have the in-line caps, I'm not sure about stacked pots either. I pretty much never use anything but the tone full-on. Oh well, maybe I'll get around to adding the 3rd pickup after I get moved...

woodyng wrote:I digress a bit here,i have another well-known highly modded Laredo which i love too. I would love to own both an 8 string Laredo,and a fretless 4 string Cii,should I ever win a lottery.

I don't think a fretless 4004L would cost too much if you knew a luthier with good prices.

Having played Joey's 4004 Ruby my last two SoCal visits, I can attest that they are good basses. While I prefer the classic 4000/1/3 look, the 4004s are a lot more versatile and cover a lot more ground.

Owned a 4004Cii/5 for a little while. The previous owner changed the pickups to active EMGs and routed for them. Beautiful bass that I should have kept. I can't compare tone because it wasn't stock for me, but it played great.

I've owned a couple of Cii's over the last 5/6 years.

TBH I struggled to get on with them. They sound fine, but I think the 'classic' Ric is so iconic in looks and tone to me, that I have problems with anything else.

I think their rarity (over here especially) doesn't help matters. Maybe if more high-profile players were seen and heard with them it might alter perceptions a little.

I for one prefer the slab body of a 4001/3 - but for players coming from say, a Fender background, the contoured shape would I'm sure be easier to adjust to.

I like the sound of the bridge pickup, the simplified controls, the bridge, and the body contouring.

The ones I owned previously (2003/2004 era) had VERY big necks. I don't mind a wide fretboard (my main bass is a 1.75" Precision) but they were perhaps a little too full & chunky for my liking.

Don't have much use for a neck pickup right up against the fretboard.

Generally not crazy about the look, which makes it tough for me to pull the trigger on another.

Someone PLEASE send me a Lefty version of the 4004, and, I'll be able to give you my review

I will always LOVE the 4001!!!!!!!!

Malchik wrote:

woodyng wrote:I digress a bit here,i have another well-known highly modded Laredo which i love too. I would love to own both an 8 string Laredo,and a fretless 4 string Cii,should I ever win a lottery.

I don't think a fretless 4004L would cost too much if you knew a luthier with good prices.

I actually looked into having my Cii converted by Larry Davis,and his estimtate was very reasonable,but i ultimately decided i liked it too much as a fretted instrument set up with the old Maxima flatwounds,as an alternative to my RW-equipped Laredo.
That's why i need another one to convert. Unfortunately i am not in "aquisition phase" at the moment.

Interesting responses so far. What I see so far (these responses added to past comments in other threads), is that a lot of folks want to see "modern" Rickenbackers for today, for RIC to grow beyond the classic models that have been made for decades, to offer something new and different. RIC has indeed listened and created new and different models in both bass and guitar models, however, it seems they have not generally been embraced by those asking for these modern Ricks; they want something new and different yet they fall back on the old tried and true.

Why is this?

Could it be old habits are hard to break? These instruments are not what people are really looking for in a modern Rick (they want modern but be just like the classics)? They are not really looking for something new and modern, just say they are?

@JB: yes, the early 4004 basses had pretty chunky necks, I agree, that is why I sold my first 4004, the Cii that had been turned into a 5 string bass by Mark Gilbert. Rick does listen though, as the current crop of 4004 basses use the same neck blank as the 4003 so now we have the same familiar feeling (a good thing IMHO).

Yes, the HB-1 pickups have a somewhat different tonality to those used on the 4003, but that is a good thing, again IMHO, this provides options for us and provides a more modern sound to go with this simpler, more modern looking line of basses.

I agree that a VVT harness makes these basses a bit more versatile having done so on my first 4004; my only criticism of the 4004 is that this is not standard on them, I do like slightly rolling back the neck pickup to open to tone a bit, perhaps the volume control could have a pull switch on it to do this but that makes things more complex?

Great comments, so far, let it continue!

Funny thing about the 4004.

My first Ric was my CS LE. As much as I love that bass, I had a problem with single coil noise in playing situations. Way back in late 2005, it was suggested to try a Cheyenne. I did and while I loved the feel and look, it had been dorked around by a previous owner. It lacked power and I soon parted company with it.

I had my first 4004cii Blueburst back around 2008/9? but the neck was way too Pbass for me. Sold it and found my current 4004cii trans blue, which for some weird reason is actually a light purple. Joey was right, because of that bass, I've parted company with my 4001 & 4003 basses. The light body makes it a joy to play for long sets, the tone gets more compliments than ANY bass (including my Alembic). When I don't show up with it, I'm asked "where is that pretty purple bass".

Never in a million years did I think a 4004cii would be my "keeper" RIC!