Rickenfaker 4001 needs help

dr_raven · Post by **dr_raven** » Mon May 30, 2005 1:44 am

Hi all, new to this forum. I recently picked up an old faker 4001 made by a company called "Northern" with a glued-in neck that is in OK shape but there are cracks on the back at the neck's heel. It looks like someone may have put on some heavy gauge strings and over the years the neck has been pulled upwards and is separating from the body wings. Here are some pics of the bass (see pic called "cracks.jpg"). Anybody know if this is worth fixing or even possible to fix? Thanks.

http://www.rainycitynights.com/band/myweekly/gearpics/R_bass/

lars · Post by **lars** » Mon May 30, 2005 2:16 am

Welcome to the forum Andy.
I doubt you'll find much support for a faker in this forum. I say: Don't waste money on a copy, get the real thing!

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon May 30, 2005 4:09 am

Real Ricks sometimes separate like that. Those aren't cracks so much as separated laminiations. Yours is a better copy that has a neck-thru design similar to what is found on the real thing. The body is made of three pieces of wood (neck and two body wings) that are glued together. Sometimes the glue fails and the lams separate like that. It can be repaired but I would get the strings off of it now because the tension could make the problem worse. The wood has to be realigned and reglued. That can be tricky when working with such a tiny gap. Getting enough glue on the faces is difficult.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Mon May 30, 2005 4:59 am

Andy, everything about your pictures looks like this could be a late 70's Rick. I've never heard of a Northern rick copy myself but AIP. As Ted states, there have been seperations at the heel/body join caused from various things, mostly string tension and leaving an instrument in the trunk of a car where temps. reach 160 degrees, there goes the glue and things start to slip or creep out of position. 2 approaches to fixing it. Clean the cracks with a razor saw, make up some thin maple shims(.020) clamp the body upside down on a work bench, using clamps and a small pine wooden block under the end of the F.B. realign the body wings to match the neck. Using Tightbond(yellow) glue, force it in the cracks, put glue on your shims and push them in the cracks, using a cabinet clamp and contoured pine blocks, clamp the body from the sides just enough to bring it together tight. Wipe off glue with wet towell,leave for several hours, unclamp and clean off excess glue, lightly sand and touch up finish. If you have these tools and the desire, go for it. Otherwise take it to a repair shop with experience, my charge W/O refin. 2 to 3 with refin. 7 to 9 these are hundereds of dollars of course. It may be worth saving especially if this is a real rick. You can take off the pick guard, post pictures of the cavities and some of us on the forum can tell if it's real.

dr_raven · Post by **dr_raven** » Mon May 30, 2005 5:16 am

Hi Lars, I hear what you're saying. I've read the forums pretty thoroughly over the last 2 days and I know that "fakers" aren't regarded too highly here, but a few folks seem interested so I thought I'd try my luck. To assure everyone, I understand and respect Rickenbacker's wishes regarding the TRC issue and I have no plans to replace the missing TRC with a real plate. I'm just interested in fixing what looks like a decent bass.

Ted, Thanks for the insight. It certainly *looks* like it would be tough to fix because there isn't much to work with as you say. I'm taking it to a luthier this week to get an estimate. I was just wondering if anyone else has run into this issue before and if there is any hope in fixing it and thanks to your post maybe there is. I'll post the results of the luthier's inspection later this week.

dr_raven · Post by **dr_raven** » Mon May 30, 2005 6:01 am

Hi Dale, wow, thanks for all the great info on the repair. The procedure sounds pretty straight-forward and I'm almost tempted to do it myself because I've always fixed my guitars for the last 20 years, but never anything like this. As for whether it's a fake or not, all I was told when I bought it was that it was a Northern "R" bass. Over the years I've seen a few Northerns show up in pawn shops, usually cheap strat knockoffs, but I've never seen them do replicas. I checked a lot of sources on the net and you're right, it sure looks like the real thing but I've also had a hard time finding anything that tells me how to identify it. Shouldn't there be a S/N on the back of the headstock though? I'll see if I can post some pictures of the pickup cavities later tonight for you if that's what you need. Thanks again for the info.

ken_j · Post by **ken_j** » Mon May 30, 2005 6:36 am

Ser# should be on the jackplate.

dr_raven · Post by **dr_raven** » Mon May 30, 2005 6:46 am

Just did a little research and found a page that explains that the Rick S/N is usually found on the jack plate... And I just saw your message Ken, thanks

I didn't take a picture of the jackplate but I will tonight. What I remember of it is that it did not have a S/N on it and that it says STEREO instead of RICK-O-SOUND. So this is likely a fake. A better than average copy but a fake still the same. I'll post the pickup cavity pics tonight when I get home from work.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon May 30, 2005 8:52 am

The inlays look fake and the postion of the upper strap button is not right. Sergio is our ace faker spotter (it borders on scary sometimes the way he spots little details). Maybe he will chime in here soon.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Mon May 30, 2005 1:17 pm

Well if it's a copy, then someone went to alot of expense to tool up to make a limited run of these. Not very cost effective.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Mon May 30, 2005 2:04 pm

At your service.
"It borders on scary sometimes the way he spots little details". Gee, Ted, don't get so heavy.

Yes, we're definitely looking at 4001 copy, however good. Even if the hardware, pickguard, pickups and tuners were not there to instantly give it away as a copy, the fretboard inlays, the slightly narrower body binding, the lame finish at the body end of the neck and a couple of further details just aren't there for anyone to make a mistake over. And what about the body? Is it solid wood or plywood? (I'm not joking).

dr_raven · Post by **dr_raven** » Mon May 30, 2005 3:27 pm

Hey Sergio,

I had no illusions, I was pretty sure it was a fake, but Ted was right about your keen eye for the details

You asked whether it's plywood, or solid... what's the best way to tell?

I wasn't able to borrow the digital camera from work tonight but I was still able to take pictures using my flatbed scanner and it actually takes better detailed pictures than the camera! Here's the URL again for the pics but there are 5 new pics including some VERY large pics of the pickup cavity so be warned it may take a while to download. There is also a pic of the jackplate and my memory served me correct; there is no serial number and no "Rick-O-Sound". If there was any doubt left, there isn't now. But it's still a nice bass and I'm going to try and get it fixed up. Thanks to everyone who offered advice and their wisdom. I'll post back here when (or if) it gets fixed up with the results. Thanks again

http://www.rainycitynights.com/band/myw ... cs/R_bass/

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Mon May 30, 2005 4:44 pm

Some of those copies are remarkably good. A few even sound like the real thing. Several forumites own or have owned one.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Mon May 30, 2005 10:49 pm

Andy, you'll be able to tell whether or not the body is plywood by scraping off some of the finish on the control cavity wall, for instance.

bob_atherton · Post by **bob_atherton** » Mon May 30, 2005 11:32 pm

Hi Andy, Welcome to the forum. Are you by any chance the Andy Skuse who played in Mantiss many moons ago?

All the best, Bob