Before the Beatles -Teen Idols

revolver323 · Post by **revolver323** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 8:07 am

"Devil in Her Heart" (Beatles Version) was the song I taught myself to play bass with. Great bass line for a simple tune.

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:28 pm

Promised to post a song recorded by Bobby Vee in 2002,lyrics are by Tim Rice or Sir Tim Rice to be politically correct(He's a big BV fan by the way and a Searchers fan, man has impeccable taste) music by Bobby Vee and his three sons.
For those of you who bother to download, simple no programme needed, I would urge you to listen closely to the lyrics, for me they sum up, what perhaps is the reason I gave my name, as Victor Kiam would say, to this small bit of Mr McCormack's empire.
http://s35.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=08DY5RNYNS0X81NYAN740SY4AH

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:49 pm

Interesting song Roy. Its not typical BV as my admittedly poor memory would have me remember him, but perhaps there are other influences that shaped this song.

It took three listens before it grew on me. The vocals seem a little rushed (and not quite as smooth as again I expected) as often songs that tell a story are. Having said that I quite enjoyed it.

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:55 pm

Thanks for listening, it does indeed grow on you and whilst I am no musician, Bobby's voice has gone down an octave or two, I think would be the correct terminology, but no doubt you can clarify that Brian.
Give another listen, or two, the lyrics are great.

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 1:04 pm

Yeh old age and lots of cigs or suds can produce that sort of effect. Frankly so can too much strain and effort to produce volume in your voice. Vocal chords can be affected by all sorts of things. It's hard to say what produced that effect on BV. Probably not fair to speculate. The story line is great though. Well worth a listen. I've always been a fan of Buddy Holly.

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 1:20 pm

By the way Roy, my voice coach (many many years ago) taught me that volume is produced by a combination of air in the lungs and controlled movement of the diaphragm. So many singers today wreck their natural voices by trying to constrict the throat and push huge volumes of air past it.

Some even push the air past their nasal passages. John Lennon for example used to like to experiment with his voice in that fashion. Regular abuse of the vocal chords though tends to produce a symptom much like laryngitis.

As you know I consider myself to be a guitar player who happens to be able to sing so don't take my opinion as the sole voice of experience in this matter. I am sure there are others on this site who can offer much in this regard.

admin · Post by **admin** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 1:30 pm

Roy: Thanks for sending this one along. In the end, that is all we all do each day ... we get through. This song is nicely written and as has been nicely stated already, this song will grow on you.

For me it took just one listen before the talent of Bobby Vee shone through. He surely knows his craft and was able to deliver this simple song in a way that connected emotionally with me.

I only have one criticism of this number and that is its production. Call me old fashioned, but I still cannot get used to the idea of using a keyboard and drum machine to substitute for the brilliance of a group of musicians who perform seamlessly as if they are one. It would also seem if Bobby's voice has been synthesized as well.

In spite of all of this, I really enjoyed it as as with most good compositions, I am the better for it. Never complain of just getting through, many are denied the privilege.

You may this place what it is Roy. Long live your comments and the joy of sharing music with others.

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 1:58 pm

Peter,

much can be done in a studio environment to provide a live feel for keyboard and effects produced by drum machines.

With modern software (Cakewalk, Sony Soundforge etc.) drums for example with not much effort can be made to sound just like the real thing. If you have a a good workstation (Roland is what I use) keyboard sounds can be altered to suit the players taste. It is a simple matter off adjusting attack and decay elements of the sound bite you are working with.

It all depends on the musicians, the arranger and the producer. They play a huge part in the development of a song that is pleasing to the ear.

IMHO

admin · Post by **admin** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 3:36 pm

Agreed Brian. I find that Bobby Vee's recording was too transparent in the percussion and keyboard though, I still enjoy a real guitar.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 3:40 pm

There is one thing a drum machine will never have and that is a soul and that also is where music comes from. I did an album with a drum machine, and after that experience I'd rather play with a washing machine than a drum machine. It was REALLY easy to play along with it because there is no interplay at all with a machine and the timing is always perfect unless they program it so it wobbles a little bit which is even worse. If I had my way I would shoot all the synthesisors to the moon and we would have honest music again.
No offense intended Brian, I just think they are the scourge of modern music.

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 3:55 pm

Yes I understand your point Bob. But on the other side of that coin I don't have the patience any more to play in a band that causes me to have to manage ego's bigger than my house.

So I will take the time when I record to play fill parts "live" and make my "drummer" sound real. All the rest I do my self "live" Guitar, bass, keyboards, harmonica, lead vocals, background or harmony vocals or whatever only because I can. Plus as arranger producer I don't have to consult a battery of people to see if they will agree to a particular time signature or key.

Life is so much simpler for me now. LOL

Synths in the wrong hands can sound blase. No soul a you put it. So in that respect we are on the same wave length. I do miss playing with real people from time to time. But I get by.

admin · Post by **admin** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 4:00 pm

Bob: Technical points aside, what do you think of the recording by Bobby Vee?

winston · Post by **winston** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 4:59 pm

Peter your observations in regard to the BV recording are spot on. I could not agree more.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:05 pm

Well, honestly I was kind of saddened at how shot his voice sounded and how buried it was in the mix and didn't get through the whole song. I actually found the lyrics kind of hard to understand. I'll try again tomorrow.

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 5:52 am

Whilst no technical expert like a lot of you I am not certain a drum machine has been used, Jeff Vee is an excellent drummer and is credited as Drums and Percussion, Tommy Vee is credited with electric and tic tac bass, Bobby himself is credited with vocals, background vocals and guitar. An additional electric guitar player is credited, Strings arranged by someone else though I would concede these would be synthesizers.