How to handle exaggerated claims?

surfrat · Post by **surfrat** » Tue May 07, 2002 12:19 pm

Every week on ebay I see sellers who are either totally clueless about their guitars or who make claims that are simply blown way out of proportion. Stuff like "one of a kind" when there are others just like it photographed on this site, "extremely rare" or "impossible to obtain" about instruments that can be obtained just by writing a check, or misdated / misdescribed guitars. Without exception these sellers all are convinced that their hogwash is true.

I contact some of these people that are the farthest out of bounds, and routinely am told that I don't know what I'm talking about. Should I even bother to try to set the record straight? I just hate to see somebody get burned, particularly if they're new to music and are relying upon these exaggerated or misleading claims to be correct. Yes I know they should do their homework but it's tough on some items. Rickenbacker is good about canceling auctions of copies, but as individuals we have NO clout with ebay, they simply state that "We're just a forum and we don't want to know." What if anything can / should be done?

rob · Post by **rob** » Tue May 07, 2002 2:04 pm

Mark-
It is a really good thing to be a "Good Samaritan," but sometimes it's just a waste of time. There are just too many people who try to screw you over just to make a buck. What could/should be done? Just make sure the joke is not on you. What else can you do?

surfrat · Post by **surfrat** » Tue May 07, 2002 2:41 pm

You're absolutely right Rob. Maybe I should just look at this as a fun hobby, and save my "righteous indignation" for the real crooks. I have to admit that I find it a good emotional release, being nasty from time to time! I'm really not out to save the world, I just think it's good karma to occasionally leave things a little better than you found them.

leftybass · Post by **leftybass** » Wed May 08, 2002 4:58 am

This is absolutely why I stress to as many people as possible to read about all you can concerning your interests, handle as many instruments as possible(from friends, shops, at shows etc...) and get to know others who share the same interests, and those who have had much experience in collecting. So if I get burned on something, then I only have myself to blame---I'm the one who ultimately decides to 'make the deal' or not...and yes, I have made enough errors in judgment to go around. That's all part of learning the hobby, a potentially VERY EXPENSIVE hobby.

"To everything, learn, learn, learn...."

markthemd · Post by **markthemd** » Wed May 08, 2002 6:11 am

I get told frequently that I do not know what I am talking about .

I get handed an instruments , and the owners tells me when they got it and what year it is and how rare they are .

Sometimes I must excuse myself ...it can be very hard to keep a straight face sometimes.

I have had people hand me three bolt necked black guard "PRE CBS" Strats before .... and they are insistant that they got the guitar when the graduated from High School in 1968.

This hold true for nearly every make and model of guitars .

I can't remember everything , so I have most of the guitar books on hand to SHOW them ..if it is worth my time .

Otherwise ....I don't respond to it .
However ...I will often leave copies of a particular page from a Book on dating their guitar.
That way ...I don't waste my time argueing.

If they don't like it well ...that is their problem .

admin · Post by **admin** » Wed May 08, 2002 7:07 am

Thanks to all for these interesting points and comments. This is precisely the reason why I consider it necessary to have an open discussion and online database with regard to Rickenbacker instruments. While we don't always get things perfect, we do attempt to gather all the available historical information with the aim of obtaining a balanced view and settng the record straight. I thanks one and all for their interest in Rickenbackers and their ongoing efforts. Jangle on!

rkbsound · Post by **rkbsound** » Wed May 08, 2002 3:48 pm

Just my 2 cents: I saw a new Rick 12 string in a store once -- went back and it was gone. I was told that it had to be repaired but if I was interested they'd call me when it was done (a bad pup). I was not interested, but soon after saw it on Ebay (listed by that same store). The repair was not listed. Now, if I had wanted the guitar it would be nice to know that a repair had been made so that if it failed again or if there was some other problem related to it, I wouldn't go beserk thinking I got a lemon. I could simply trace the problem back to that repair. No big deal. It's just a matter of full disclosure. As a result of seeing that guitar listed the way it was, I will not shop in that store again. Why would I? Funny how they are also no longer a RIC dealer!

doctorwho · Post by **doctorwho** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 11:06 am

I'll add my 2-cents' worth, too.

First to Mark (Surfrat), keep plugging away. I do the same thing, and yes, there are some who ignore knowledge when offered freely (and authoritatively!) - you cannot enlighten those who refuse to be enlightened, nor make dishonest people honest. But take solace in those that you send the info to who respond favorably (and often, most generously with the accolades) because you have helped to improve the selling community.

One thing I wind up doing is putting buyer and seller together; because I have a very keen memory for the trivial, i often will read an ad and remember that I saw a corresponding other-party ad for the same item at some other site, so I e-mail the seller or buyer and let the person know of the other's existence. I have been thanked on at least one occasion by a successful transaction, and that's reward enough.

I absolutely concur with John's (Leftybass) comment, and I try to preach this to everyone possible. I see people paying above list price on some items, and I don't understand why they didn't do the homework to find out what a good selling price would be. Even when it comes to lab equipment (which I often buy for the company I work for), I always check the completed items to see what other ones sold for (I did this before buying my Korg D16 a couple of years ago, so when I did get one, I got it at a very good price). It's so simple, but many people don't do it.

I think one thing everyone in this thread has shown is that each of us carries specific knowledge, but we don't know everything about everything, so it's important to share as much as possible with others. Kudos for Peter for supporting this forum!

banta · Post by **banta** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 2:12 pm

Mark, marketing exaggerations are a fact of life. It's the buyer's responsibility to know what they're buying. While I too have tried to correct sellers' errors, they often do not care if what they're stating is truth or fiction as long as they get the item sold. Ah, capitalism. "Truth in advertising" is the most common oxymoron of our society.