I have a 1994 4003 that's stock except for the addition of the .0047uF cap. to the treble pickup. What would happen to the sound if I replaced both stock pickups with new vintage reissue pickups?
Thanks.
Vintage Reissue Pickups Sound Difference
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chucksimms
- Veteran RRF member
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I've had a few 4001/4003's, and I now have a 4001CS with the vintage pickups. To my ears there's a tremendous difference throughout the spectrum. The bass pickup sounds less 'boomy' and the treble pickup is much 'fuller' sounding. I always found the bridge pickup was weaker in output on my other Ricks, but the horseshoe is a perfect match.
'66 365 O.S. FG, '66 335 FG, '68 375 O.S., '66 330/12 MG, '69 365 O.S. azureglo, 2007 4001C64
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jwr2
There are a few different types of Ric bass pickups ...
1 - you have the old vintage 60's horseshoe and toaster pickups.
2 - you have the reissue horseshoe and toaster pickups.
3 - you have the high gain from the '70s
4 - you have the high gain from the late 80's to present.
All of them sound different.
The horseshoe and toaster make a classic sound with the capaciter added. The new pickups are similar but not indetical to the old ones. For instance the magnets on the new toasters are longer.
The 70's high gain pickups were hotter than the toaster and horseshoe pickups.
The 4003 high gain grom the late 80's to now are hotter and thicker sounding, they are wound different.
I prefer the newest Ric pickups. For those of you who think this is too thick, then turn up the treble and high mids and cut your 250k on the eq ...
A nice combination is the new hot pickup in the bridge and a toaster in the neck.
Another nice combination is a 70's high gain in the bridge position and a new 4003 in the neck.
I personally only like the capaciter with the horseshoe pickup ... for all of the rest I remove it.
If you want the vintage pickups then try to find a 4001v63 bass of a 4001cs or get one of the new Paul Mcartney reissue basses.
I'm not sure if they put the capaciter in the reissue basses but they have the old style pickups.
1 - you have the old vintage 60's horseshoe and toaster pickups.
2 - you have the reissue horseshoe and toaster pickups.
3 - you have the high gain from the '70s
4 - you have the high gain from the late 80's to present.
All of them sound different.
The horseshoe and toaster make a classic sound with the capaciter added. The new pickups are similar but not indetical to the old ones. For instance the magnets on the new toasters are longer.
The 70's high gain pickups were hotter than the toaster and horseshoe pickups.
The 4003 high gain grom the late 80's to now are hotter and thicker sounding, they are wound different.
I prefer the newest Ric pickups. For those of you who think this is too thick, then turn up the treble and high mids and cut your 250k on the eq ...
A nice combination is the new hot pickup in the bridge and a toaster in the neck.
Another nice combination is a 70's high gain in the bridge position and a new 4003 in the neck.
I personally only like the capaciter with the horseshoe pickup ... for all of the rest I remove it.
If you want the vintage pickups then try to find a 4001v63 bass of a 4001cs or get one of the new Paul Mcartney reissue basses.
I'm not sure if they put the capaciter in the reissue basses but they have the old style pickups.
…but DEFINITELY go re-issue plus cap... haha
you will love your bass. For the total treatment, like I did mine, a V63 pickguard and a little routing with a Dremel would be in order (3/4" X 3/4").
Let me know if you'd like emailed you a pic of my 4003S with her OEM hardware on the deck in front of it.
Regards,
Garry
you will love your bass. For the total treatment, like I did mine, a V63 pickguard and a little routing with a Dremel would be in order (3/4" X 3/4").
Let me know if you'd like emailed you a pic of my 4003S with her OEM hardware on the deck in front of it.
Regards,
Garry
The ideal mix leaves the bass player louder than the rest of the band put together!
It's interesting that Jeff mentioned a Toaster neck PU and a Hi-gain bridge PU should make a good combination because I've been toying with the idea of changing the neck PU to a 7.4k Toaster.(20% for the "legendary" sound that I haven't experienced in person yet, 80% for the sake of "look", I have to admit.)
I however found that the output level of my hi-gain neck PU is at least 1/3 lower than that of the bridge hi-gainer already. is this normal? (Average distances between polepieces and strings:Neck--4/32, Bridge--3/32.) So I'm afraid that a 7.4k Toaster would yield an even lower output.
I know I could lower the Bridge PU to balance but that would make the bridge PU's sound less "in your face".
Has anyone done the mod and is willing to share his/her experience/impression sound-wise?
Also, has any of you senior owners of RICs performed pickup and control cavity shielding? How good are your results?
Please chime in.
I however found that the output level of my hi-gain neck PU is at least 1/3 lower than that of the bridge hi-gainer already. is this normal? (Average distances between polepieces and strings:Neck--4/32, Bridge--3/32.) So I'm afraid that a 7.4k Toaster would yield an even lower output.
I know I could lower the Bridge PU to balance but that would make the bridge PU's sound less "in your face".
Has anyone done the mod and is willing to share his/her experience/impression sound-wise?
Also, has any of you senior owners of RICs performed pickup and control cavity shielding? How good are your results?
Please chime in.
Usually it is the other way around, i.e. it's the treble pickup that has less output. How about raising the bass pickup? See topic "Making the 4001/4003 Neck Pickup Fully Height Adjustable". Or how about replacing the original magnet with a stronger one?
As to shielding, yes, I've shielded the control cavity AND removed the string ground in all my Rick basses with great results. Pickups too need to be shielded. Details on request.
As to shielding, yes, I've shielded the control cavity AND removed the string ground in all my Rick basses with great results. Pickups too need to be shielded. Details on request.
A Rickenbacker bass is much like the Jaguar E car - perennially ultra-fashionable.
Sergio,
I had already raised the neck pickup to its limit without cracking the pickguard since day one. Maybe this one is one of the "defeated goods" from RIC?(Damn! I bought it new.)
What can the possible causes be to make a RIC hi-gain put out a low(fat but low) level?
Is there any way to detect the bad part(s) and repair them before resorting to buying a new one?
I'm planning to do the shielding(pickups and control cavity) to my baby, what should I take notice?
What should not get in contact with the shielding material(aluminum foil)?
What difference does it make to remove the sting ground(the one connected to the bridge's mute pad base?) ?
I'm pretty new to handling a soldering iron on a guitar(technique and knowledge wise), so please forgive my asking silly questions.
I had already raised the neck pickup to its limit without cracking the pickguard since day one. Maybe this one is one of the "defeated goods" from RIC?(Damn! I bought it new.)
What can the possible causes be to make a RIC hi-gain put out a low(fat but low) level?
Is there any way to detect the bad part(s) and repair them before resorting to buying a new one?
I'm planning to do the shielding(pickups and control cavity) to my baby, what should I take notice?
What should not get in contact with the shielding material(aluminum foil)?
What difference does it make to remove the sting ground(the one connected to the bridge's mute pad base?) ?
I'm pretty new to handling a soldering iron on a guitar(technique and knowledge wise), so please forgive my asking silly questions.
Paul, you are not asking silly questions.
I think I know what the problem is with your 4003: it was made in 1993, and by then RIC had stopped fitting basses with the .0047 capacitor but kept using the large magnet for the treble pickup, which as a result sounds louder than the bass pickup. The answer is either installing such a cap or replacing the bass pickup magnet with a stronger one. I once had a 1992 lefty 4003 with the same problem.
Re shielding, cover the whole underside of the pickguard and both the wall and the bottom of the control cavity with aluminum foil. Even the inside of the holes for the mono and stereo outputs must be shielded. Also shield the treble and bass pickup cavities and disconnect the treble pickup chrome surround and handrest from the ground loop. All live parts of the circuitry must not touch the shielding foil. Removing the string ground will not result in noise once the guitar is properly shielded, plus it eliminates shock hazard.
Shielding the pickups is relatively easy, however unless you do it properly they will look shoddy. Sometimes it is not necessary to shield both of them. If you require further tips on the finer points please advise. Let me know how it goes.
I think I know what the problem is with your 4003: it was made in 1993, and by then RIC had stopped fitting basses with the .0047 capacitor but kept using the large magnet for the treble pickup, which as a result sounds louder than the bass pickup. The answer is either installing such a cap or replacing the bass pickup magnet with a stronger one. I once had a 1992 lefty 4003 with the same problem.
Re shielding, cover the whole underside of the pickguard and both the wall and the bottom of the control cavity with aluminum foil. Even the inside of the holes for the mono and stereo outputs must be shielded. Also shield the treble and bass pickup cavities and disconnect the treble pickup chrome surround and handrest from the ground loop. All live parts of the circuitry must not touch the shielding foil. Removing the string ground will not result in noise once the guitar is properly shielded, plus it eliminates shock hazard.
Shielding the pickups is relatively easy, however unless you do it properly they will look shoddy. Sometimes it is not necessary to shield both of them. If you require further tips on the finer points please advise. Let me know how it goes.
A Rickenbacker bass is much like the Jaguar E car - perennially ultra-fashionable.
Sergio,
Thank you very much for the tip.
My 4003 was made in May 1998. So the fact that the bridge pickup is louder than the neck pickup should be normal for this one.(Thank God !) And my favorite knob setting is the bridge PU cranked while the neck PU backed off a bit to get some bite and increase the bass of the amp to compensate for fatness. So again, I should not be bothered by the difference in the 2 pickups' output levels.
I'll however get a 7.4k Toaster and see what happens soundwise besides improving the look. (By the way, IMHO, the Toaster should rank one of the best looking pickups money can buy.)
I'll begin the shielding job and the mod for making the neck pickup fully adjustable following your other post, probably around 'Xmas time.I shall need some more of your advice then. I'll post or email you when problems are encoutered.
Thank you very much for the tip.
My 4003 was made in May 1998. So the fact that the bridge pickup is louder than the neck pickup should be normal for this one.(Thank God !) And my favorite knob setting is the bridge PU cranked while the neck PU backed off a bit to get some bite and increase the bass of the amp to compensate for fatness. So again, I should not be bothered by the difference in the 2 pickups' output levels.
I'll however get a 7.4k Toaster and see what happens soundwise besides improving the look. (By the way, IMHO, the Toaster should rank one of the best looking pickups money can buy.)
I'll begin the shielding job and the mod for making the neck pickup fully adjustable following your other post, probably around 'Xmas time.I shall need some more of your advice then. I'll post or email you when problems are encoutered.
You are most welcome, Paul.
Yes, the toaster pickup is one of the best looking pickups around. As concerns its performance on a bass guitar, though, I've always felt that it could be a bit better, which is why I've made some modifications to the toaster on my 1970 21-fret 4001 in order to get more output and a balanced string-to-string volume.
Yes, the toaster pickup is one of the best looking pickups around. As concerns its performance on a bass guitar, though, I've always felt that it could be a bit better, which is why I've made some modifications to the toaster on my 1970 21-fret 4001 in order to get more output and a balanced string-to-string volume.
A Rickenbacker bass is much like the Jaguar E car - perennially ultra-fashionable.
Paul,
When you install that Toaster, you will fid 360-Style rubber grommets installed under the height adjustment screws. To get that last little bit of height PRIOR TO INSTALLATION, replace those grommets, one by one, with thin or ultra-thin metal washers. That it the one and only regret I have about the way I went about my pickup mod job.
Good Luck,
Garry
When you install that Toaster, you will fid 360-Style rubber grommets installed under the height adjustment screws. To get that last little bit of height PRIOR TO INSTALLATION, replace those grommets, one by one, with thin or ultra-thin metal washers. That it the one and only regret I have about the way I went about my pickup mod job.
Good Luck,
Garry
The ideal mix leaves the bass player louder than the rest of the band put together!
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mortivan