The Good Old Days

anonymous · Post by **anonymous** » Thu Jan 31, 2002 10:52 am

Peter

I suupose the question is similiar to "was Frank Allen an Original member?"

There can be no doubt historically that Tony Jackson was the lead singer, but equally there is no doubt that Mike Pender became the voice of The Searchers.

We tend to ovelook the fact that Spencer James also has without question been the voice of The Searchers since 86.

anonymous · Post by **anonymous** » Sun Feb 03, 2002 6:12 am

Yes Roy I was just checking. Mike Pender surely will be known historically as the "voice of The Searchers."

sowhat · Post by **sowhat** » Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:24 am

Good old days - good old thread...
I'd take ANY lineup... in fact, the nowadays lineup with Spencer and Eddie also rocks, both guys are great at what they do.
There's of course some live material recorded both from the 60s and from the 'modern days', even some videos, but to me, live recording and live show are not actually the same thing. The atmosphere of a live show and people around you, and your "heroes" just a few meters from you is something that's hard to keep on the record...
and...
"I wish i had a Time Machine
To take me to whenever i will,
Large green wings of Summer
And an angel at the wheel..."
Yes i wish... and i also wish both the current Searchers and MPS last for as many years as possible...
Cheers,
SC

budrocket · Post by **budrocket** » Thu Dec 29, 2005 2:11 am

> I suupose the question is similiar to
> "was Frank Allen an Original member?"

Well if one were to get technical about it -- & one could well ask the same question about the Hollies' Bobby Elliott -- I suppose the answer would be no, but he is certainly a member of their "classic" line-up from their best known period in the 60's, & that's "original" enough for me.

Not to knock Tony, but I don't think he was versatile enough to accommodate the changes they went through musically, & Frank was the perfect addition. I wonder what might have happened had Chris been allowed to hire Pete Best to play drums & moved up to the front line like he talked about...hmm.

Now if you really want to wrap yourself up in knots ask who are the original members of The Big Three <g>

bw

PS - In other slightly off-topic news, my Xmas present to my girlfriend/bandmate in the Dixie Bee Liners this year was a Burns Marquee electric guitar, & she's already set about learning "Apache" & "The Rise & Fall of Flingel Bunt." Given that we are primarily an acoustic bluegrass band, this could very well have some "interesting" ramifications for us in the months to come... Oh what have I wrought? <g>

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 1:41 am

The Big Three emerged from Cass and The Cassanovas. The line up you may looking for Buddy would be Brian Casser, Adrian Barber and Johnny Gustafson.

I don't think they were actually called The Big Thre though till Casser had left and been replaced by Adrian Barber.

The line up that enjoyed some modicum of success though was Gustafson, Griffiths and Huthchinson who replaced Barber.

Mentioning The Shadows brings up the debate was Brian Bennett an original, answer no but as he has been in the band for 43 years in my book yes.

sowhat · Post by **sowhat** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 2:15 am

...remember the Beatles? anybody willin' to say Ringo is NOT an original?

Just kiddin' of course...

budrocket · Post by **budrocket** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 4:32 am

Good point!

So would that make Johnny Sandon an original Searcher? <g>

bw

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 4:41 am

Not Really they were his backing group. I think the whole issue surrounding originals has to be clarified.

For me I class originals as the members who made the first recordings those in the group prior to that are part of a band's history.

Some may argue that Best was a member when they recorded My Bonnie but whilst correct they were not known as The Beatles then and record was credited to Tony Sheriden anyway. The other tracks Ain't She Sweet, Cry For Shadow were only released after they became famous as The Beatles.

Best featured on the Decca tapes but they were not an official release.

budrocket · Post by **budrocket** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 5:15 am

Hang on now Roy...I don't mean to be argumentative but do I understand you to mean that you don't classify Pete Best as an "original" member because he wasn't on the Parlophone records?

I would argue his status could be confirmed in a number of other ways, mainly that he was a member of the group when they were known as "The Beatles," he's in their publicity photos taken both before & after Epstein put 'em in suits & represented them to different labels, they were known as "The Beatles" when they auditioned for Decca & EMI, even if those tapes weren't officially released until much later, & I dare say the punters in Liverpool certainly considered him as such...

No offence intended, but with all respect due you I don't follow your reasoning on this one.

bw

mygeneration · Post by **mygeneration** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 5:53 am

I understand what you are saying Roy, and I think most fans of sixties music would agree with you, but strictly speaking "original" means just that, irrespective of recordings, photo shoots or anything else.

In which case, wasn't Norman McGarry the original drummer of The Searchers?

Gary

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 6:01 am

Buddy be argumentative that is what debate is about, I fully accept your point what I was trying to say badly was that as far as Original goes I class those who made the first recording as original.

Yes I concede that Pete Best was part of Beatles history and therefore has to be classed as a original member in strict meaning of the term.Even though other three in my view never considered him as such.

John McNally would argue that Chris Curtis was the third drummer in The Searchers and that even Pender and Jackson were not originals as "originally" Brian Dolan and Tony West formed the group with him, but for me that is part of the group's history, in my book the orignal line up is the one who made Sweets For My Sweet.

You mention Hollies I think and I agree with you there Don Rathbone was the Original Drummer albeit for 2 singles.

Never seen any photos of Best in a suit with The Beatles though Buddy.

budrocket · Post by **budrocket** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 6:09 am

Well I don't shy away from debate, but I just trying to be polite & all.

Alas I don't have any way of posting photos, someone else here will I'm sure, but for now if you look on page 17 of Mark Lewisohn's "The Beatles Recording Sessions" you'll see one of the Best "suit shots" from the photo session they did in June of 1962.

bw

royclough · Post by **royclough** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 6:14 am

And I appreciate that Buddy also don't doubt your veracity for one second. Interesting topic in some ways.

Gary,good point, join the debates on Cloughs Classics sometime.

sowhat · Post by **sowhat** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:22 am

Oh-oh... Pete Best started a debate here... cool

With all respect due to three of you... my point is, "Original" is a subjective term, just for an argument to this point, John McNally said in some interview that for some fans of his band, Spencer James is an original, if i got his words right.
Just to "sum up" - who is an original? The points of view listed here:
a) an original is the one who was in the first band lineup, no matter if he was or was not featured on any records and no matter how long did he last in the band;
b) an original is a member of the lineup which had the first chart entry & was the most famous;
c) an original is anyone who an average (or not an average) fan considers to be an original.
Maybe there can be some other points of view?
Cheers,
SC.

budrocket · Post by **budrocket** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:41 am

> And I appreciate that Buddy also don't
> doubt your veracity for one second.

Thank you sir...suppose what I was really trying to say is I come to a lot of this 2nd hand, I realize you have a better sense of these things than I, having experienced much first-hand, so I'm happy to bow to your knowledge.

bw