Music123.com -- No Longer a Mail Order Ric Dealer!

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sat May 13, 2006 4:47 am

Michael, you are slipping on one point here, with all due respect.

Rick is not "penalizing the customer". They are a manufacturer, and are doing what any other sensible manufacturer would do when one of their accounts doesn't pay their bills--they cut them off. It is unfortunate that the customer gets it in the shorts, but that's between the customer and the dealer. RIC is doing business. Were they to continue doing business with a dealer who refused to pay them, producing instruments to order, but taking no new orders, what does that do to the business relationship, and who's to say that those instruments would ever make it into the hands of the customers who ordered them? What if M123/WWBW shut their doors overnight (which is effectively what they have done--to Rickenbacker customers)? Where would those guitars go? Into the hands of the receivers, not to the customers.

We sometimes, and repeatedly, tend to personalize our relationship with RIC because they are more present in our hobby/obsession that the management of Fender, Gretsch, PRS, Gibson, Taylor, etc., are in the lives of the owners of those brands. And, yes, it is true, they are as passionate about making these beautiful instruments as we are about playing and collecting them.

But, in the end, it's business, as it must be.

loendmaestro · Post by **loendmaestro** » Sat May 13, 2006 5:41 am

It seems RIC is really tightening up on who they deal with now. Everybody knows my disdain for Guitar Center, so the severing of that relationship didn't bother me. But they also cut ties with Atlanta Discount Music - who is my favorite indie guitar store in Atlanta. They've had some financial problems in the past, so I'm not gonna speculate on who, what, where, & why they can't sell Ricks anymore. The thing is now there is NO authorized RIC dealer in Metro Atlanta. Not one. The closest would be Savannah - about 5 hours away.
That leaves mail/web order as your only option here. I would think that RIC would want at least one authorized dealer in a major city such as this. But if you can't pay you can't play I guess!

It's really interesting.

jps · Post by **jps** » Sat May 13, 2006 6:40 am

I know that Zon also in recent years pulled out of many dealers for various reasons. Dealers have a responsibility to both manufacturer and customer, If they can't play the game right, they lose, unfortunate that they take the customer out too, but, oh well.

ajish4 · Post by **ajish4** » Sat May 13, 2006 7:40 am

My first RIC was purchased from an actual "store", my 4001CS in 1995. Shortly after, they went out of business, I MEAN just a few weeks after.

It NEVER occurred to the us that they were in trouble, but my wife had to pay CASH for it JUST SO THEY COULD GET IT OFF THE UPS TRUCK, she knew "something" was up! I mean she gave the cash to the salesperson, and he handed it right over to the USP guy! If my CS arrived a few weeks later, the Mrs. would have lost her 50% deposit and I'd have missed out on my CS!

ALL of my other RIC basses have been purchased on the web. IT can be a real pain in the butt, ESPECIALLY if you need warrantee service.

I guess I'm opening a can of worms here, and forgive my ignorance but wouldn't RIC CONSIDER selling DIRECT to customers that don't have an authorized dealer within, oh I don't know, an arbitrary 75 miles from one's home? Even if they charged a surcharge (to be fair to their dealers) would it be too difficult to pull off?

I know they have enough to deal with, but I have a similar situation that unless I want to drive 2 + hours to Orlando or Miami, I'm doing the mail order thing too.

I was lucky enough to find this forum and was referred to POTR and TRP, and I'm really happy to deal with them, but what about the people who are out there just clicking on the first site they find?

Just a thought...

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sat May 13, 2006 8:35 am

We need to consider here the structure of the RIC organization. RIC is a manufacturer. Period. Everything comes down to that. To modify the very nature of their business is probably the least likely thing to happen.

What we're looking for here, is a solution to a nonexistent problem. RIC gets dealer applications, they qualify dealers, and dealers sign on. If they meet their end of the contract, they stay.

The holes in the network will eventually be filled, sooner or later, is my guess. It behooves RIC to be consistently represented.

rkbsound · Post by **rkbsound** » Sat May 13, 2006 10:21 am

I'm not sure how they can't pay their bills, unless there is a minimum purchase they need to make and pay upfront for the year. When I ordered my Rick, I figured the deposit was used to pay RIC. The balance was mostly the store's take.

incubus2432 · Post by **incubus2432** » Sat May 13, 2006 10:24 am

"ALL of my other RIC basses have been purchased on the web. IT can be a real pain in the butt, ESPECIALLY if you need warrantee service."

That isn't really an issue. Rics requiring warranty service are sent directly to them for service. I've needed warranty work twice over 18 years (I'm quite picky) and both times the shipping/repair went off without a hitch. I very much prefer this method vs. most other companies that have "authorized service centers".

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:16 am

J., the simplicity of your bookkeeping is admirable...

If only it were so with M123 and their ilk...

And, Brian, as you might have guessed, it's a lot easier to have Factory Authorized Service Centers when the necks are put onto your brand with power screwdrivers...

kcole4001 · Post by **kcole4001** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:20 am

Not to mention lower standards in general.

jeff_ulmer · Post by **jeff_ulmer** » Sat May 13, 2006 12:56 pm

"I very much prefer this method vs. most other companies that have "authorized service centers"."

I don't. Shipping guitars across the border is both expensive and a good way to have the guitar damaged. One way shpping with insurance from here is not only a 6 hour round trip to a UPS shipping center, but a $300 shipping cost on top of that. No thanks. I much prefer being able to take the guitar back to the dealer and have them take care of it.

myfretless · Post by **myfretless** » Mon May 15, 2006 3:19 pm

RIC insulates itself from liability by selling only to retailers.

RIC also saves itself from overhead and contract complications by streamlining it's manufacturing-only status.

The end result I think most potential purchasers should appreciate is the fact that all this keeps the price lower that it would be otherwise.

jingle_jangle · Post by **jingle_jangle** » Mon May 15, 2006 3:54 pm

These are incidental effects of being a manufacturer, but Brad's post somehow (probably unintentionally) makes it sound like they are reasons that RIC is organized as it is.

RIC does not insulate itself from liability; as a manufacturer it is liable for the quality of its products and the suitability for their intended use.

Any overhead saved would be rather small unless Rickenbacker opened its own retail outlets. Contracts with dealers are quite a bit more complex that the contracts which a dealer enters into with its retail customers.

What keeps Rickenbacker prices low in comparison to other boutique manufacturers is their policy of fair markup, a stable product lineup, and no debt load.

xcoyle · Post by **xcoyle** » Mon May 15, 2006 6:44 pm

A little off topic, but did anyone get any good close-out deals from M123. IMO they have great deals when they want to get rid of something. They also had the cheapest vintage cases I could find at $186.00 delivered at an every day price.

I picked this up, but I'm late to the party I'm sure.
http://www.music123.com/Rickenbacker-00003-i160819.music

firstbassman · Post by **firstbassman** » Tue May 16, 2006 6:39 am

Yes, I have purchased several "close-out" items from M123. They have all different types of "close-outs" too. Some came w/o the original box (Hartke amp) or sometimes there is a little cosmetic defect (Ibanez Artcore guitar). And sometimes a discontinued model. All great deals.
Actually I have to force myself NOT to look there or else I'll just keep on buying MORE stuff.

webhead · Post by **webhead** » Tue May 16, 2006 8:12 am

Funny thing... I got the new M123 catalog. Inside was a RIC 4003 bass advertised for sale. I checked the website and they're offering a Midnight Blue 370/12 as a closeout.
The first time I tried to order with them was last year, it was nothing but misery. I ordered one of those McCartney Epiphone's for $6K only to be told 2 weeks after I ordered it and got confirmation of shipping that it was promised to someone else. Then I end up getting 2 of them 2 weeks after that. They both went back. I then ordered a Gibson ES355, which came with the headstock broken off. Funny, there was absolutely no damage to the box. Then I ordered 3 BlueBursts last year and a 380L. All cancelled... So when I get the catalog- I flip thru it to look at the pictures, then it goes in the trash.