Less sound from the E with the bass pickup

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue May 06, 2003 4:30 pm

I wonder if anyone out there has experienced lower output from a Ric bass pickup, especially on 4001's. And if you have what did you do about it? Right now all my basses are fine, but in the past I have encountered several like this resulting in an almost hollow sound from the E string, adjusting the pickup didn't really help much. I took several apart and physically moved the guts (magnetic part) a little closer to the E string side of the bass, this also helped a little but not much. It seems to me, that the buttons come at different relative heights with different basses (relative to each other that is), but I have had the same problem with a V63 with a toaster pickup in it. That pickup responded better to moving the internals than high gains did. I had one '75 4001 with an especially soft E string, with that one I took the rubber grommet (or whatever you call it) off the bass side of the pickup under the pickguard, which moved the button closer to the string, it then sounded equal with the others, but really was too close to the pickup. I have observed this with newer Rics also, so I don't think that it is a matter of the pickup going dead. Right now I have a 4001 with a loud E string (again bass pickup) which I like. (I started out on P basses) A drummer friend of mine had also observed this before, and I hadn't mentioned it to him. Are the pickups all the same, or are they adjusted individually for the bass that they are put in? I had another '79 4001 with a replacement 4003 pickup (don't know the year) and it had a very soft E string.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue May 06, 2003 7:47 pm

Try a fatter E string ...I used to play slinker strings ... 95 or 100 ... now I play sets that are 105 or 106 ... I even experimented with 110 ...

This will give you a louder and fatter sound on the e string ...

my strings are usually .045 .065 .080 .105 .126 ... sometime the low B is .125 or the a is .085 ...

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Wed May 07, 2003 2:34 am

Yeah, the problem's in the E string rather than the pickup. Usually I'm faced with the opposite problem - an E string that's too loud. Either way, a pickup having adjustable polepieces always comes in very handy.

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Wed May 07, 2003 6:32 am

Is it on certain fretted notes or across the board?

If the former, something to try is adjusting the truss rod just the tiniest little bit in either direction. It doesn't have to enough that you really notice any neck movement. All instruments have some harmonic interaction with the truss rod system and it's worse, obviously, in a double rod system. Essentially you're just tuning the rod a bit to a note that's not so bothersome.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed May 07, 2003 11:07 am

Very interesting John, I had been wondering perhaps if the resonant frequency of the body had anything to do with it, all wood is a little different. On the basses I have had it has always been the open E, the fretted notes got increasingly loud as you went down the neck to about the third fret were it was usually equal to the others, on the '75 I had it was like that until maybe the seventh fret, it seemed the closer I got to the pole piece the louder it got, hence my experimentation with taking off the rubber grommet. I have experimented with different strings also, and with different strings I have adjusted the truss rods. I have never really encountered this problem with a 4003 and with various strings. So I just don't know, it was almost like I had a dead note except that it was the open E. I have had no problems with treble pickups, either horse shoe or high gain. always equal and easily adjustable. And I usually use 105's for the E. This bass had a neck like a rock by the way, I put Fender Med. gauge flatwounds on it for a month (these would bend a telephone pole, and they helped somewhat)) and the neck was still straight, exactly as it had been after I adjusted it. Which brings me to one more question: Will strings with too much tension cause this? I like my basses to play tight and usually use high tension strings. But I think I answered my own question, If I encounter this problem again, I'll try Johns method, just moving the rods a little bit. Very strange though.

admin · Post by **admin** » Thu May 08, 2003 5:59 am

Bob: The fact that you notice your problem on the open E string only is of interest to me. I too have had this problem in the past on my 4003 and it has been due to to separate problems.

My first experience was due to a problem in which the E string sat in the slot. By rounding the slot and winding the string on the tuning shaft such that the string started at the top and wound downward close to the headstock the problem was solved. The string did not resonate as it was poorly seated. If you can see light under the E it is time to make this adjustment to my way of thinking.

On the second occasion the E string was not true and a replacement string solved the problem as I had already implemented the slot adjustment.

These are straight forward and simple suggestions but sometimes the simplest tweak, such as the one John Hall has mentioned, does the trick.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Thu May 08, 2003 10:18 am

Thanks Peter, the bass unfortunately is long gone but I did round out the nut, the string was not properly seated, unfortunately I overdid it a little and had to buy a new one, I think that with that bass I tried everything mentioned and then some, the only thing that really worked was as I have said before moving the button very close to the string by taking the rubber grommet off of the pickup under the the pickguard, but obviously that is not a proper solution. I wish that I had kept it, (needed the money to get married,... should have kept the bass,..) ((just kidding in case my wife reads this))as now more than ever I am intrigued by this problem, I tried many different strings too. I wish now that I had switched pickups with another bass temporarily to see if that would had solved the problem, but I will never know.

admin · Post by **admin** » Thu May 08, 2003 10:41 am

Bob: You will have many strategies should you ever experience this problem again.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Thu May 08, 2003 11:30 am

Ha ha, thanks.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Thu May 08, 2003 2:34 pm

Some speaker cabinets are not tuned properly ... they will resonate too much on some frequencies ... and have a lack of resonance on other frequencies ... see if the same bass does the same with other speaker cabs or see if other basses do that in the original cab ...

robj · Post by **robj** » Fri May 09, 2003 4:22 am

Here's a thought. When I first got my 4004C I noticed the E string's volume was out of balance with the other strings as Bob described. The tech at the shop who ordered the bass for me made some adjustments but the volume was never right. A few months later I played the bass and noticed no signal with the toggle set to the neck pickup only. The bass was under warranty and was returned to the factory for repair.

While there, both pickups were replaced and Wow what a difference. To that point I was less than pleased with the sound of the bass. Based on my experience I'd say it's possible the neck pickup on your bass is marginal and in need of replacement.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Fri May 09, 2003 10:55 am

Robert, At this point I have come to the conclusion that it may have been the neck pickup, but the pickup sounded great on all other strings and from F on up on the E string. And Jeff I've used the same cabs for almost thirty years, and know their frequency curve like a book, and have had other Rics at the same time which didn't do that. They are old SVT's (8X10's) I think the specs on them indicate that they drop off slightly below about 50 cycles (approx.G on the E string) at least that what an audio engineer told me many years ago, but it is not really audible to me. At this point on that bass anyway, it will remain a mystery, because unfortunately I had to sell it last year, it was a beautiful bass too.