John Birch Guitars and RIC TM infringement.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 12:49 pm

Philip: It is no different from automotive stylings or any other application where aesthetics dress a functional design. A guitar's shape used to be a reliable indicator of its brand. Brand recognition is key to the survival of that brand.

Distinctive shapes universally identify brands. Kitchenaid mixers and Volkswagen Beetles are good examples of that. I believe the term JH used is "trade dress". Cars without body panels would be difficult to identify and distinguish from other cars. The shape of the sheet metal is essentially the car's identity - trade dress.

I long for the days when a Jazz Bass was a Jazz Bass, and a Les Paul was a Les Paul. Copies are out there but for the most part, if you see something shaped like a Rick, it is a Rick.

ajish4 · Post by **ajish4** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 1:34 pm

Ted:

Very good point. When I see a Corvette, I KNOW its a Corvette. The look is distinctive. I identify the CORVETTE by its SHAPE.

When I was younger and I would walk into a music store, I'd notice the SHAPE of the 4001/4003 from across the sales floor. My heart would race and my pace would quicken as I headed off in the direction of the familiar shaped BEACON that so quickly drew my attention. I used to get so PO'd when I'd find out it was an Ibenez or Univox. The SHAPE was the FIRST thing that drew my attention.

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 5:10 pm

Ted, you're preaching to the choir. Philip is an attorney in the U.K. and he's probably the only other person here that understands what we're doing.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 5:14 pm

I guess I misunderstood his meaning. Sorry Philip.

jdogric12 · Post by **jdogric12** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 6:05 pm

Just remember... "Aspirin" was once a trademarked name. Guess why they lost it. They should have gone RIC-style if they wanted to keep it.

ben_hall · Post by **ben_hall** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 6:48 pm

Kleenex anybody?

leesh · Post by **leesh** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 6:57 pm

Haha! I like that.

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 8:21 pm

I'll Xerox that...

philipharris · Post by **philipharris** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 10:33 pm

Thanks John; sorry Ted, I thought you knew. There have a been a few threads on these subjects and I try not to comment on the issues (however much I'm bursting to!). The aspirin ref is a very good example of what happens if you don't take action against misuse, though. As is the fate of the standard GIBSON/FENDER designs. Once it's gone, it's gone for good. However, over here in the EU/UK "shape" marks generally are a "hot" issue right now, and in my view guitar designs are a special category. Hence my rather sad reference to a research project. Or perhaps I'll just go strap on my CS and make some incredibly loud noises instead.

ken_j · Post by **ken_j** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 3:32 am

The John Birch bass:

grayk · Post by **grayk** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 4:07 am

Ian mentions earlier in this thread of seeing a Ric lookalike guitar. He didnt get the name but I know of the one he is talking about. They are called "Rockinbetter" I did not have my glasses on one evening whilst perusing the window of a closed music store near my home. I saw this "Ric" and thought "what has come over this guy" as he only ever sells bottom end of the market stuff. It just didnt figure that he would have a Ric. I reached for the glasses and sure enough I was then able to recognise that it was indeed a cheap copy. These eyes were fooled at first though I have to admit. The writing on TRC is in a very similar style and is the same length so it is very deceiving.

lucky · Post by **lucky** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 6:26 am

I think that these are made by Tokai.

12stringbassist · Post by **12stringbassist** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 6:38 am

That's the name. Yup. very cheeky using the same lettering style too.

It looked very nice (and would fool most people from a distance though the tailpiece was not all all Ric-ish) and only cost a couple of hundred pounds compared to about a grand for a Ric, but in the end you get what you play for. Mind you, Tokai did make a science out of producing brilliant looking / sounding guitars at one stage... Dawsons in Manchester stocked the Tokai copies, as I believe HW in Bolton did too, which is where I've seen those.

12stringbassist · Post by **12stringbassist** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 6:40 am

Oooooooo!

http://www.jsdguitarshack.com/dillion_rockinbetter.html

12stringbassist · Post by **12stringbassist** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 6:44 am

A Google search reveals a Tokai 12 '360 clone' review from http://www.harmony-central.com/Guitar/Data4/Tokai/Rickenbacker_360_12_Clone-1.html

Price Paid: £259
Features: 9
12 string electric, bound upper body and neck finished in Fireglo, 24 frets semi hollow body, 2 toaster top copy pickups. 12 Kluson style tuners.
Basic tailpiece and modified tunomatic bridge.

"Rockinbetter" headstock plate (older models has "Tokai")

However, it may be a clone but this has the sound!!

Sound: 10
This has the real Rick sound as the string arrangement is correct, i.e. you strike the high strings first on the downstroke. Rhythm strums get you the usual 12 string rich sound but it's playing individual notes that gives you the real Rick style sound (McGuinn/Harrison etc etc)- before you know it, everything you record suddenly has to feature some 12 string Rick.

Action, Fit, & Finish: 9
Superb value for money (only £259 in the UK), only a slight bridge tweak to lower action slightly and replace the strings (easy once you do them one "set" at a time - the secret!!). Fireglo finish very good and binding work neat. Bridge pickup slightly low but I've got a luthier sorting out raising this up by 8-10mm to even out the sound. I will be replacing the tailpiece with a Rick one as the original is made for a six string but has all 12 crammed in so eventually needs sorting.

Reliability/Durability: 9
Built to last, with the exception of the tailpiece as described earlier. The key with a 12 is tuning stability, this is fine at the moment (was 100% in tune hanging on the shop wall - a first and a good sign)

Customer Support: N/A

Overall Rating: 10
If you want the proper Rick jangle, get one of these before they stop making them. I don't think you can buy these in the US as Rickenbacker have put a stop to that. Forget the Line 6 Variax (I bought one thnking this would do, it's just a chorus aplied to a six string), this is the real deal. If you can fix up a better tailpiece and possibly bridge (the Rick one is the ultimate piece of engineering, with 12 separate saddles), this is a keeper.
I was ready to buy a Fender XII but this is half the price and has the definitive 12 string sound for me.

Submitted by Pat at 02/11/2006 02:02