What are the best strings for Fretless Rics?

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Thu May 15, 2003 9:25 am

Hello all,
I have a 72 4001FL, I've been using Med.light gauge Fender flatwound strings on it, but they exert a lot of tension on the neck. What type of strings does Ric use on the new 4003FL's, and are they OK for my 72? Is the varnish the same on the old ones as the new ones? How are these Pyramid flats everyone has been using? One thing I now know is to not use round wounds, I had an early 80's 4001FL and put Rotos on it and after one night there were buzzes all over the place. I used Rotosound half rounds for a while, they sounded great but went dead quickly so I stripped the neck and used two part epoxy on it a la Jaco, and completely ruined the sound of the bass, it became very dead sounding. So I guess what I'm looking for is some good flatwounds that won't stress the neck too much, or maybe some good half rounds that won't eat the finish on the neck (and won't stress the neck too much).

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Thu May 15, 2003 9:33 am

what about the tape wound flats??

ricnvolved · Post by **ricnvolved** » Thu May 15, 2003 10:26 am

Bob-- The Pyramid flatwounds are my favorites. They sound great and have a silky smooth feel to them. IMHO, you can't go wrong with these.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Fri May 16, 2003 9:22 am

Jeff,
If you mean the Rotosound flats, they are huge and very dead sounding, I think the E is something like 125 or even 135, and most of that girth is tape, or did you mean some other kind?
And Jeffery, I'll try the Pyramid flats as soon as I get back to the states. what is the tone like? Are they bright? Smooth sounding? Have a nice fundamental? And I would still like to know what Ric puts on their 4003FL's now. I like their round wounds, they are nice and sweet sounding, John Hall?

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Fri May 16, 2003 12:16 pm

I had been using the Rotosound nylon tapewounds on my fretless for a number of years but recently tried a set of something else which has been often recommended here; unfortunately the E was absolutely dead, defunct, and deceased so I took them off within the hour, putting back the old Rotos to do some tracks.

While contemplating the next move, I fortuitously found a set of original Maxima flatwounds here at the office and put these on instead. Normally I would be concerned about fingerboard wear but I figured I know where I could get it restored and refinished for free!

Anyway, it's a nice solid sound, dark the way I like a fretless but with a hint of bright as well. I don't know what I'll do when these wear out but the Rotosounds are not out of the question for me.

tbass66 · Post by **tbass66** » Fri May 16, 2003 12:22 pm

I really like the Pyramids also..they sound great and are not overkill in the tension department. They sound smooth and sort of thumpy on my ric but i can still dig some highs out of them. You can also try the rickenbacker tapewounds..i think the guage is 45-55-75-105, Mike Parks sells both www.the-music-connection.com/ricpart.htm

p.s. think ric still uses the tapewounds on the frettless bass

paul_yan · Post by **paul_yan** » Fri May 16, 2003 3:00 pm

Tom,
Yes you're right about current 4003 FL basses sporting the black RIC 45-55-75-105 tapewounds.

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Fri May 16, 2003 5:12 pm

While we're on this subject, does anyone here have a fretless 4001 with a recent issue toaster in it? What does it sound like through just the toaster? I'm thinking of turning a 3000 bass into a fretless with a toaster. The bass didn't have it's original pickup. Then again, perhaps Mr.Hall has an NOS 3000/3001/2050/2060 pickup lying about that he would graciously sell me!

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sat May 17, 2003 12:48 pm

Maxima.. Those sound familiar to me, are they still made? John are the Rotos you use the ones with the big E Strings, or are they the ones that Ric uses, that the others have mentioned with the same gauges as your roundwounds? And I like the gauges of your roundwounds too. And Dane, my FL has an original toaster in it, and it sounds very similar to the current toasters. The toaster alone is very deep sounding, will shake any room with an appropriate amp. I am not very familiar with 3000's but my toaster is 1/2 in. from the neck which is a big part of the reason it is so deep sounding. If your bass is a one pickup bass the pickup is probably closer to the bridge than mine and will sound more balanced. With my bass you really need the mid and top from the high gain in the bridge position for clarity. I love the toasters sound though, very big. But then again I like all Ric pickups, especially the new high gains. One of these might be a good choice as they are hot and full sounding, I'm not sure which would be better for you, the bass or treble pickup, probably the treble. I don't know about string spacing either.

ricnvolved · Post by **ricnvolved** » Sat May 17, 2003 7:49 pm

Bob-- Mr. Hall is probably referring to the Pyramid Gold flatwounds having a "dead, defunct, deceased" E string. Others here in the forum have reported getting a fresh set of these strings with the E dead out of the package. However, to my knowledge, Pyramid and the retailers made good on a replacement and I think most who were inclined towards flatwounds anyway were happy with the tone & performance of the Pyramids.

It really does depend on what you're looking for in a string. Some of the forum members have absolutely no use for flatwounds on their Ric bass (or any other bass, for that matter.) These players want the bright, aggressive tone you get with roundwounds. That's not what I want, although I certainly respect their preferences. Ric 4001/4003 basses are historically more trebly in tone and, even with flatwounds, I still get plenty enough high-end for my taste.

Should you ever be interested in black nylon tapewounds, I strongly recommend the ones made by LaBella. I have a set of these on my Zeta Crossover 4-string and can vouch for the quality construction and tone of those strings.

P.S. to Mr. Hall-- Why would you be concerned about wear & tear on the fretboard of your bass from flatwounds?

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sun May 18, 2003 12:28 pm

Thanks Jeffery,
I also assumed he was talking about the Pyramids too, I have had similiar problems with E strings when the wound part of the string actually touched or even went around the peg part of the tuner, could that have possibly been the problem? I have had that problem with Roto roundwound RS66 in the past, the E was too long for the bass.
On the other hand I have bought a few sets of the flatwound stainless Rotos and with both sets the G string was absolutly dead, and the rest were actually too bright with not enough bottom for me anyway. I like a nice consistant sound from a string from bottom to top, which is why I like the flatwounds on Rics. They are bright enough so that flatwounds don't sound thumpy on them unless you want that sound and then you can get a great thump from a Ric, it is great for blues, or old rock 'n roll. I use original equipment Ric stainless roundwounds on one of my 4001's, and those sound great too, and also play great.
Over the years I know a lot of the pros swear by Labella flatwounds, maybe I'll try those too. Thanks all.

ricnvolved · Post by **ricnvolved** » Sun May 18, 2003 2:27 pm

Bob-- Rotosounds seem to be quite a popular brand with some of the forum members. Even I will own up to using Rotosounds exclusively back in my early days of playing. However, back then string choices were quite a bit more limited than what they are now. Not that it mattered: they were good quality (though very expensive) and I liked them very much. But not now. Number 1 reason is that I don't play roundwounds anymore, regardless of brand name. The other reason is that I don't trust Rotosound's quality control.

Several years ago when I was still subscribing to "Bass Player" and "Bass Frontiers" magazines, there was an article & interview with Billy Sheehan. I've never been a fan of his, but what he had to say in one part of the article was very surprising. He talked about having been an official paid endorser of Rotosound strings. However, he had personally talked with numerous of his fans on several occasions and they complained to him about getting bum Rotosound strings. He promptly relayed this information to Rotosound and voiced his concerns about it considering that he was a paid endorser. According to Sheehan, Rotosound promised to look into it and get the quality control issue taken care of.

Sheehan then said he continued to receive complaints about bad quality Rotosound strings from other users, and this was after the company supposedly had plenty of time to care of the problem. By then, he felt he had no choice but to end his association with Rotosound.

I'm not a Sheehan fan, and I have no ulterior motive to slam Rotosound in relating this story. Any company can produce a lemon on occasion. Just because some forum participants had problems with Pyramid Gold E strings isn't going to dissuade me to stop using Pyramids. (Unless there were a high number of users reporting problems and Pyramid ignored them. THEN I would definitely take notice.) But when a high profile player like Sheehan feels compelled to talk about continued quality control problems from a string manufacturer that pays him to be an endorser.................... well, that's something pretty difficult to ignore.

My humble advice to anyone regarding strings: play what works best for you.

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Sun May 18, 2003 3:42 pm

In the past I've always had nylon covered strings on my fretless and they were supplied that way for years from our factory. That was the basis for my concern about fingerboard when wear switching to uncoated strings. (I did consider the Elixir Polywebs but decided the RIC/Maxima NOS set was a more conservative choice.) So far I haven't noticed any particular wear to the finished fingerboard surface.

I'm sorry to hear that my low E experience was not an isolated incident.

ricnvolved · Post by **ricnvolved** » Sun May 18, 2003 4:32 pm

Mr. Hall-- Thanks for filling me in on the black nylon versus standard flatwound subject. This is actually the first time I've heard anyone voice concern over fretboard wear from common flatwound strings, whether the wrap was stainless or nickel. I'd always thought it was a non-issue compared to roundwounds, especially the stainless variety. But if anyone here has noticed flatwounds eating up a fretboard, then I would certainly want to know about it.

I wasn't aware that Maxima produced flatwound strings. Do any other bass players here in the forum have any experience with these?

tbass66 · Post by **tbass66** » Mon May 19, 2003 7:19 am

I would like to try Maxima strings myself but i hear they went out of business..anyone know more about that?