360 12 string, new nut but still hard to play

trancedental · Post by **trancedental** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:10 pm

I've installed a new 330 nut on my 360 12 string.

The guitar is easier to play now than it was, but I was wondering if I should have shimmed or sanded some of the nut underneath to get the nut closer to the fretboard at the 1st fret.

I've tried a 12 string capo on the 1st fret & this is very easy to play this way so I was wondering what distance a well setup guitar would be between the neck at the 1st fret?

I've checked the neck & it seems OK & it's very similar to my 330 which is a very easy guitar to play, are Rickenbacker 12 strings usually the same action as 6 strings?

I've got a couple of Dan Earlwine guitar setup / repair books but nothing about Ricks or 12 strings in there, I got some ideas for my Epiphone Sheraton setup & that guitar now plays great.

Any advice would be welcome especially details of mesurements / distances on how far the top of the nut should be from the fretboard.

doctorwho · Post by **doctorwho** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 2:44 pm

John, I think I remember an earlier thread in which the distance of the strings from the first fret was specified. IIRC, the nut is dry fitted, the distance measured, and the bottom of the nut is sanded until the dry fit measurement is correct. The nut is then glued in place. I'll see whether I can find that thread.

doctorwho · Post by **doctorwho** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 3:08 pm

It must be a retired thread, as I can not find it. I did find this on the web:

http://www.guitarpicker.com/Library/Setup101.htm

If you scroll down to "3. Adjusting the String Height at the Nut" it gives some info on the subject.

This other website actually provides some real numbers:

http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/nuthigh.htm

... Fret each string individually starting with the High E between the second and third fret and pull out your feeler gauge out to check the amount of space between the bottom of the string and the first fret. You should have approximately .005" of space between each one with the string barely touching the second fret. If this measurement is close or dead on then move on to the next string right up to the Low E string. You may want to jot down the gap on a scrap piece of paper as you move across the fret board to see the nut slot's height in relation to the fret board as you do so ...

One other thing, the other way to lower the string height at the nut is to cut the slots deeper; I think taking material off the bottom of the nut is preferred, however.

Can we have some experts' opinions, please!

trancedental · Post by **trancedental** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 4:25 pm

Thanks Gary, I've managed to adjust the bridge & lower the action so it is playing better now.

I remember when I compared the old 360 nut with the new 330 nut the newer nut was slightly thicker so I maybe should shim a bit off so they match up?

The action is a bit lower than I like & playing C chords is still slightly arkward but much better than before.

When I sort the nut out hopefully it will play OK then I'll raise the action back up & check the intonation which seems alright at the moment.

trancedental · Post by **trancedental** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 8:06 am

Just sanded the new 330 nut down to about the same level as the old 360 12 nut.

Tuned up & it's playing better, easier to fret & the chords are ringing out much more!

As I've got a spare old nut I'll sand that one down a bit more to see what that plays like then take the new one down to that depth if it works out OK.

Done a search on nut heights & first fret measurements on here & the Rick site but no luck finding anything so far, help still needed LOL!

I've installed Pyramid flatwound strings on my 360 12 but am not impressed at all, four of them have broken already,three of them wound as well!

Luckily I've had a few spare Thomastik flats to replace them with.

I don't think Thomastik do a 12 string flats set? If I could get single flats I could make up a set easy enough?

karl_teten · Post by **karl_teten** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 5:45 pm

John, you can get TI singles and make up a set.

I would first put all 12 strings on your guitar. Starting with the bigger strings, tune these up to pitch. Then tune the octaves up to pitch (but not the octave G just yet - leave it alone). Tug the larger strings lightly at the 12 fret a few times starting with the low E, then A, etc. and tune all up to pitch (do the B's and high E's too). Now do the octaves starting with the low E. Gently tug at the 12 fret and then tune up to pitch. Once complete, do the octave G LAST. This method should prevent string breaks from happening.

karl_teten · Post by **karl_teten** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 5:47 pm

For RIC 12's I prefer TI flats over Pyramids. Same sound but less tension.

karl_teten · Post by **karl_teten** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 3:48 am

John,

You can also email Mark Arnquist for the 'how to' 12 string nut information. He'll send it to you for free along with photos. You can have your tech do it for you with Marks instructions.

[email protected]

trancedental · Post by **trancedental** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:38 am

Thanks Karl I'll see what Mark has to say