Unable to find 4004/5 Cheyenne II

carr · Post by **carr** » Wed May 28, 2003 12:37 am

There is an old adage in business. "If you have more (business) than you can handle, your prices are too cheap"

Hands up those who want Ric to increase their prices?

banta · Post by **banta** » Wed May 28, 2003 3:07 am

Don't get me started.

I've been waiting for a new 4004cii5 since it was prematurely announced. I was interested in the "new 4004cii8 8 string" as well.

I'm playing Zons in the meantime. I like my 4003S/5, but my enthusiasm has been squelched by Rickenbacker. A new breed of Ric bass is overdue.

dave4004 · Post by **dave4004** » Wed May 28, 2003 9:23 am

According to my source who has always been reliable, 5 string and up basses have been stable for several years at about 25% of the bass market. With all due respect, they will have a permanent place but I'd hardly call that the wave of the future. High end stores and high end and custom makers like Zon aren't representive of the whole market. 4s are in no danger of being overtaken or displaced by 5s.

robj · Post by **robj** » Wed May 28, 2003 12:48 pm

Dave,
The industry numbers I have seen are a little higher for the percent of 5 string and up basses sold per year than those your source provided, but not enough to indicate that the 4 string bass is on its way out. It's all a matter of preference and I don't think the 5 string is for everyone. I play a Modulus Q5 which I bought new in '91, so I've been at it awhile. I do recall making the change from 4 to 5 was frustrating at times, and some people don't want to deal with that.

When I got my first 4004 and really connected with it I began hoping for a 5 string model and haven't been shy about mentioning it to John Hall on many occassions on the alt.guitar.rickenbacker newsgroup. So I think I have been waiting as long as anyone for this new bass.

ojobob2 · Post by **ojobob2** » Wed May 28, 2003 1:35 pm

i will never find a use for a 5 string, as i dont like the sound of those really low pitched notes. I think those low notes overpower the rest of the band.

If you listen to a lot of reggae and dub recordings, the bass tone is so "fat" that the low E note of a four string sounds about two octaves deeper than usual. So low E seems sufficiant to me.

And i personally cant see myself wanting to get used to a different way of playing for the sake of a couple of extra notes.

Four strings still rule

dave4004 · Post by **dave4004** » Wed May 28, 2003 6:01 pm

I'm strictly a four string guy but it makes no difference to me how many strings someone else plays. Just different strokes.

My older son plays 5ers with (shudder) active preamps. I haven't disowned him.

ricnvolved · Post by **ricnvolved** » Wed May 28, 2003 7:06 pm

I'm totally with Owen on his post. Although I can see a definite advantage in convenience by playing a 5-string, I cannot see getting used to one and then having any more use for my 4-string basses. Also, like Owen, I really haven't heard a 5-string bass (regardless of brand) that has a really good sounding B string. Many have talked about a 35 inch scale bass providing a noticeable improvement in clarity; I'm not convinced. And I will not play another bass with active electronics (my Zeta Crossover being the grudging exception to the rule.)

Yes, the unquestioned convenience of having that low B string is sorely tempting. But this old dog is unwilling to give in to learning that 5-string trick and abandoning his 4-string arsenal.

Owen, you're absolutely right: "Four strings still rule"

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Wed May 28, 2003 9:31 pm

I feel the same way about the extra string so I converted my 3001 bass to B E A D tuning. I widened the string slots in my nut to accomodate the first four strings for a Rickenbacker 4003s/5. Adjusted the action and intonation and it sounds great. I have a V63 horseshoe in it and the thing's a monster! I prefer short scale 3000's now but I don't think a B would sound good on a 30 1/2" scale so I have the 3001 just for certain types of material.

banta · Post by **banta** » Thu May 29, 2003 4:45 am

The B sounds great on my 4003S/5, as it also does on my Zon Legacy. The construction of the bass matters more than the scale length.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Thu May 29, 2003 5:06 am

I used to be a diehard 4 string guy .... from the 70's though the 80's and 90's ... The problem is some of the music I play requires notes lower than a low E .... so I had one bass tuned E A D G ... then another tuned to E flat .... then one tuned D G C F .... Then I tried B E A D .... finally when I play a 5 string I have one bass that can do it all ...

It takes a while to reprogram your brain to grab the right string ... but it is worth it ... Now when I play a 4 string I feel awkward ... I am used to the 5 string ...

The optimal scale for a B string is 35" ... too long for most players ... 33 1/2" works fine ... so does 34" ... setup and string gauge have a lot to do with it as well ...

rickenbrother · Post by **rickenbrother** » Thu May 29, 2003 2:35 pm

If the 4003S/5 was suitable for fingerstyle playing I would have bought one when they were first introduced, but the strings were too close together. I'm sure RIC would have sold more of them had it appealed to bassists of all playing styles, like the 4004Cii5 would.....if it was ever made.
I also think the 4004Cii5 should have a B string that is heavier than .115, those thin B strings are loose and don't sound good. I have a 4001 tuned BEAD the B string is .130 it is not floppy and sounds great.

jps · Post by **jps** » Thu May 29, 2003 4:25 pm

Joey,
You can always restring it.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Thu May 29, 2003 5:22 pm

The 4003s5 is finger friendly ... if you retrain you fingers and get used to it ... it is even thumb slapping friendly ... I was playing mine tonight and I use a pick, I finger pluck, and I use the hammer on technique.

Never use a b string less than .125

But a lot of players prefer wider spacing ... I have a lot of basses and none of them are as nice as my 4003s5 basses ... they really did a good job on these basses ... too bad they didn't make more ...

rickenbrother · Post by **rickenbrother** » Thu May 29, 2003 6:00 pm

Jeffrey, I would restring it, just sayong that you can still get a great sound on a Rick which has a scale length less than 34" with a thicker B string, were as some players might say the B string will not sound as good less than 34".

Jeff Rath, too bad they stopped making the 4003S/5 before they started making the 4004Cii5. I was seriously considering buying and forcing myself to get used to playing it.

banta · Post by **banta** » Fri May 30, 2003 6:43 am

The 4003S/5 is much more comfortable for me to play with a pick. In fact, I'd say it is the perfect five string for pick technique. However, wider spacing is more suitable to fingerstyle. I almost never use a pick on my Zon V.