Nut Removal

sir_andrew_of_left_coast · Fri Sep 08, 2000 10:02 pm

(Gosh... the subject title sounds painful!)

Seriously though, I am "mulling over" the possibilities of installing a roller-type nut on my guitar. Obviously, such a mod requires removal of the existing nut. Are the nuts on a Rickenbacker very difficult to remove? I am assuming they are glued. Yes?

markthemd · Post by **markthemd** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 9:13 am

If you were to install a roller nut ...you would need a mill to align the neck to remove a given amount of material from the end of the fretboard.

Lets say that you want to install an LSR nut.You will need to make a block for the assembly to sit on and then you need to know the precise measurement to remove from the end of the fretboard.

This whole operation is not for the amateur,nor is it for the average repair shop.This must be done by someone who has a full/firm grasp of how to do this and not some guy with a bench in a warehouse in back of a music store that has a Dremel tool and a set of screwdriver and says that he's a Luthier...andf he proudly displays his member ship card to a couple of Luthier groups.Big Deal!!! This is a seriuos leap and if you don't like the out come then too bad.
Personally I'd think twice about this concept before doing it.
If this guitar look like the Mexican Army used it without a case and road horseback thru Juarez withit ....then ok ,I might consider doing the job.But if you just want to make the Accent Vibrato work better.....sorry it won't happen.you are limited to a concept/style of tailpiece that is self limiting and the roller nut won't help.

To correctly locate a roller nut,the center of the rollers is the point that is the edge of the fretboard .To instal it what ever that diameter of the roller is,you must remove at least that much from the end of the fretboard.Meaning you move the nut assembly closer to the first fret until the center of the roller is at the former edge/end of the fretboard.

Still think this is a great idea?What is the guitars radius on the fretboard and does the roller nut match this radius?

Lots to think about but no turning back.

sir_andrew_of_left_coast · Sat Sep 09, 2000 11:08 pm

Mark,

Thanks for the response. First, let me assure you this is NOT for a guitar with an Accent vibrato. If you want to see the guitar in question, click the "Photos" link from the Menu board on this site, then click the "Features" link, and then click the "Dakota Dreams" link.

I realize this is not something to rush into. Like I said, I'm in the "mulling it over" stage. I am aware of the need to have a properly radiused nut, etc.

Back to my original question. Assuming the factory-installed nut is glued, where is the glue applied? On the bottom (the thin edge that contact the neck) or on the side (the edge that contacts the perpindicular side of the fret board)? Or is glue applied to both areas of contact?

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 11:58 pm

both the end of the fretboard and the surface of the headstock,score the edge with a #11 Exacto knife or a utility knife (with a new blade) then tap with a wooden block up against the fretboard side .Don't hammer it like a claw hammer to a nail ...just tap and take your time.If you scored the edge correxctly you will not lose any finish.Don't try to score the edge depth on one pass.

milo · Post by **milo** » Thu Feb 15, 2001 5:19 pm

What kind of glue would you recommend when replacing the nut? It will be a factory part not aftermarket or different material.

markthemd · Post by **markthemd** » Fri Feb 16, 2001 2:57 pm

We used Yellow woodworkers glue in the old days.

I have used many in my shop ...more often than not I use 5 minute epoxy .I use it because it is fast ,a poor long term glue ,meaning it releases and allows a replacement without removing any wood .And...the glue as 'hardened' can be removed easily.
Sometimes I will use Cyanoacrylate glues .But I don't like to .They wick into the woods,wreck havoc on Fender nut slots.

Take yer time ,I use a block of wood and a rubber mallet and score around the edge with a #11 Exacto knife too.I tap toward the neck first ...this will help to release it .DON't beat on it .Take your time !

leftybass · Post by **leftybass** » Fri Feb 16, 2001 3:31 pm

Hey Mark, is it a different appraoch when using a brass nut as far as adhesion?? Do you have to rough up the surface???

markthemd · Post by **markthemd** » Fri Feb 16, 2001 4:38 pm

With brass nuts I ALWAYS use 5 minute epoxy.

Run the side over some 220 or 150 grit sandpaper .

To remove a metal nut ,just use a soldering gun or pencil and run the hot tip over the top of it ,then when the glue lets loose ,grab with end nippers and lift out .To remove unwanted glue ...Clean off the old glue from the nut ,reinstall in the 'slot' and reheat .Run a chisel or similar device across the glue area and scrape off the glue when it is gooey.

Marty · Post by **Marty** » Fri Feb 16, 2001 6:51 pm

Thanks for the info Mark,I'm thinking about a brass nut and a hip-shot "D"tuner on my 6 360.I
will let you know how it go'es.

markthemd · Post by **markthemd** » Sat Feb 17, 2001 12:04 pm

DON'T put the two together...the brass will not last ,the wound round string will dig in and you will get pinging.

try a phenolic plastic.Go to a plastic supplier ....look in the Yellow Pages phone book under plastic ...there you will find someone that carries large quantities for industry.They ALWAYS have a scrap bin.You may not find exactly your 'size' but you will find it .And color ...well don't be too choosey.
Another option is A knife makers supplier .they have all kinds of handle materials.

Use parallel /round/rat tail files for this slot cutting.