Whis is a Ric a Ric and when is is not?

rikk · Post by **rikk** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 4:25 am

Seeing the wonderful projects undertaken by Ted, Dane and others it got me wondering. How much can you alter a Ric and still have it be a Ric? Ted's 4002 project has new walnut wings, new body wings, new fingerboard. The only thing Ric is part of the neck. When Ted gets gone is it still a Ric? If someone replaced the neck on a Ric, kept the body wings would that be a Ric? What if they replaced all the electronics and had it refinished? Still a Ric? Does the wood make it a rick? The neck? The Ric finish and electronics are very uniquely Ric.
I think this might be a fun discussion. When I think of my Ric's I think of the playability and sound. For the most part they come from the neck, that's the part of the bass that you are closest to and at all times actually touching to play.

henry5 · Post by **henry5** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:15 am

I'd tend to agree that it's the core of the bass (which I would probably consider to be the neck), but I guess as long as you don't replace everything I'd still consider it a Ric; once a Ric always a Ric! I'd be interested to hear JH's perspective though!

ram · Post by **ram** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:45 am

Darn good question. I’d agree core is the key. If you replace a bridge with a Hipshot – Still A Ric. If modifying electronics with Ric parts – Still A Ric. Some may argue about non-Ric parts but most minor stuff probably wouldn’t be a big deal… Fingerboard, tuners, paint, number of strings – SAR. So the actual lopping off of body parts and cutting off the neck and replacing it with a F$#%$r bolt on then - Not A Ric. Depending on the severity of the mods the ax may get the * beside its name; as in problematic sports statistics…

s4001 · Post by **s4001** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 7:05 am

It seems that Rics are more akin to vintage cars than guitars in the way the Ric enthusiasts approach them. The things that Boyd Coddington does to cars is not original, but collectible nonetheless. Where Fender enthusiasts will look down on almost any modification or restoration act to an instrument.

kcole4001 · Post by **kcole4001** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 7:14 am

And yet they like to order them 'distressed' from the factory! Quite contradictory.

jps · Post by **jps** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 7:15 am

This is a common issue with restoring vintage Ferraris, too. Some older racing cars only have parts of the chassis left that is original, causing some consternation regarding whether they should be considered replicas or the real thing.

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 8:42 am

John Hall saw all of Dane's creations on display at the 75th and did not seem to have a problem with any of them bearing Rickenbacker TRCs. There were real Ricks at the core of all of those instruments.

It is a good question nonetheless. How much of an instrument must remain for it to rightfully be called a Rickenbacker? I have thought about this many times and to my mind the neck is the essence of the instrument. However, that does not make my Lakland Skyline with a '72 Fender neck a Fender (or a Lakland either for that matter). On the other hand, removing a neck from a 4001 is a bit more involved than loosening four screws. Does that matter? In the case of the faux thousand two project, I removed damaged wood will replace it with new pieces. The only exception being the headstock wings. But replacing the head wings on Paul Boyer's '72 did not make it any less a '72 Rickenbacker. Jack Hering's bass is no less a Rickenbacker either. My project bass will be simply a modified 4001 when completed. That, I believe is the answer to the question. When wood or hardware are replaced, the instrument is no longer an original factory instrument but still retains its identity. It is up to the market then to determine its value. As long no pretense is made as to its authenticity, it is what it is.

dswp · Post by **dswp** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 8:47 am

I say that it must be 51% original to still call it a Ric…

rickfan60 · Post by **rickfan60** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:18 am

How does one determine 51%.

dswp · Post by **dswp** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 9:54 am

Now that's a question>>>>>

rickenbrother · Post by **rickenbrother** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:00 am

So, if Ted's project 4001 become less than 51% original, would it then become a Rickentedder?

ram · Post by **ram** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:03 am

maybe a Tedenbacker???

12stringbassist · Post by **12stringbassist** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:56 am

Perhaps the body and neck should be original, or perhaps modded somewhat. Changing pickups and bridges is personal stuff.

There has to be a large element of original guitar in there!!

jwilli · Post by **jwilli** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:21 am

We'll have to appoint a committee. Oops, sorry, I've been reading/watching/listening to too many politicos. :-p

rikk · Post by **rikk** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:34 am

Seems like the census is the neck at the core of what a Ric is.