NEED speaker help
Moderators: rickenbrother, ajish4
I use a little compression pretty much all the time, all it does is tighten and even things up a bit and doesn't add volume really. You can of course squash the heck out of your notes if you want and make them sustain like organ bass pedals.
It's also worth noting that the majority of bass on records has been compressed and limited either during tracking, mixing or both. From what I've read a lot of McCartney's tracks were compressed when record and then again during the mix.
I get lots of different sounds out of my hands too (as we all do Im sure) but I don't believe compression necessarily gets in the way of it.
It's also worth noting that the majority of bass on records has been compressed and limited either during tracking, mixing or both. From what I've read a lot of McCartney's tracks were compressed when record and then again during the mix.
I get lots of different sounds out of my hands too (as we all do Im sure) but I don't believe compression necessarily gets in the way of it.
Here's a decent article on the all important amplifier to speaker power relationship. I had a much better one in my favs folder but can't locate it at the moment.
http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/voltageloudness.html
http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/voltageloudness.html
I guess my main complaint with compression is that it inteferes with dynamics when I play, If I wack the E, I want to hear it MUCH louder than if I just touch it. I know that there is a lot of compression on records and probably a lesser amount on CD's, and a lot on radio. I like natural dynamics in my music, I realize that with reproduced audio tcompression is a neccesary evil (to me), but with my bass, all I want is a good old SVT and a Ric bass, that to me is the epitome of great bass sound, everything else is a compromise IMHO. I don't even like guitar effects, just old Marshall and Fender amps. Hey, I'm a geezer, what can I say? I also like garage rock a lot. Because I was there in those garages, haha. I think I'm just an old fashioned bass player who was drawn to it before anyone used any effects on bass except maybe a fuzz box, there weren't even any tuners when I started as I'm sure was the same with a lot of you, and I just bought my first one a few years ago.
I think all of these things take the charactor right out of music, the inherent flaws are what I like about the older stuff and are what makes the older music real. Tuning by ear, maybe a little tremelo in the guitars, and tube 3 channel boards made a LOT of good music. Modern music is much more technically perfect, but give me that good old rock 'n roll anyday, haha. Or for that matter, that good old jazz or country, etc.
I also realize that there are as many opinions as there are people and if I step on anyone's toes I apologize, but I just say it as I see it, which I realize is not necessarily correct all the time, just my opinion, which is why I like this forum, I've learned a LOT since I've joined it.
That was a good article BTW, but I say if you are clipping your amp to the extent that you are putting out complete square waves your band must be extremely loud to not hear that, because square waves are not music, it is complete distortion, the more an amp distorts the more the top of the round peaks of the sine wave gets clipped off, that is why they call it clipping, if they are is clipped to the point of being square, the instrument that is being played is probably unrecognizable, like an old fashioned fuzz box that sounds like a buzz, those are square waves. I'm not talking about a complex wave form like recorded music here, just a single note bass guitar. I also realize that maybe not all frequencies of a note get clipped either, but it should be very audible anyway. When I clip my SVT I hear it right away, and clipping also hurts my ears, and SVT (tube) clipping is pleasant unlike SS clipping.
And I apologize for the thesis. fail? back to the drawing board.
I think all of these things take the charactor right out of music, the inherent flaws are what I like about the older stuff and are what makes the older music real. Tuning by ear, maybe a little tremelo in the guitars, and tube 3 channel boards made a LOT of good music. Modern music is much more technically perfect, but give me that good old rock 'n roll anyday, haha. Or for that matter, that good old jazz or country, etc.
I also realize that there are as many opinions as there are people and if I step on anyone's toes I apologize, but I just say it as I see it, which I realize is not necessarily correct all the time, just my opinion, which is why I like this forum, I've learned a LOT since I've joined it.
That was a good article BTW, but I say if you are clipping your amp to the extent that you are putting out complete square waves your band must be extremely loud to not hear that, because square waves are not music, it is complete distortion, the more an amp distorts the more the top of the round peaks of the sine wave gets clipped off, that is why they call it clipping, if they are is clipped to the point of being square, the instrument that is being played is probably unrecognizable, like an old fashioned fuzz box that sounds like a buzz, those are square waves. I'm not talking about a complex wave form like recorded music here, just a single note bass guitar. I also realize that maybe not all frequencies of a note get clipped either, but it should be very audible anyway. When I clip my SVT I hear it right away, and clipping also hurts my ears, and SVT (tube) clipping is pleasant unlike SS clipping.
And I apologize for the thesis. fail? back to the drawing board.
Bob - i agree - music (particularly live) is better with no effects and gadgets
All you need is: a bass, a big amp, a lead,err strings.... yeah i think you get me
All you need is: a bass, a big amp, a lead,err strings.... yeah i think you get me
The email address shown is down, you can email me at [email protected]
-
jwr2
I am seriously hooked on my Line6 POD ... It is great for tone shaping into an amp ... amp modeling, a touch of distortion, and compression ...
All of the above can be over done and can take away more than they add ... but when done in moderation they add a nice character to the bass sound ...
I turn the compression up about half way
All of the above can be over done and can take away more than they add ... but when done in moderation they add a nice character to the bass sound ...
I turn the compression up about half way
Caution!
philosophical dissertation.
The term "effects" can be defined any number of ways and a purist may well include tone controls in this definition which makes sense since "pure" amplification would be just the bass plugged into the preamp/amplifier, and on out to the speakers. Tone controls are used to color the sound by adjusting the frequencies which are then amplified and therefore "effect" the sound of the bass.
Any thoughts on where the line should be drawn? I think anything that is delay based would qualify, like reverb, chorus or echo for starts. Compression in it's basic form could be considered a sort of automated volume control.
philosophical dissertation.
The term "effects" can be defined any number of ways and a purist may well include tone controls in this definition which makes sense since "pure" amplification would be just the bass plugged into the preamp/amplifier, and on out to the speakers. Tone controls are used to color the sound by adjusting the frequencies which are then amplified and therefore "effect" the sound of the bass.
Any thoughts on where the line should be drawn? I think anything that is delay based would qualify, like reverb, chorus or echo for starts. Compression in it's basic form could be considered a sort of automated volume control.
You nailed it pretty good, Robert.
From this recording engineer/producer's point of view, "effects" include: reverb, echo, delay, chorus, flanger, phaser, ADT(auto double track), etc, which are all delay-based.
Compressor/limiter, gate/expander can be put into the "gain device" catagory whose VCA (voltage controlled amplifier) controls the device' output level.
EQ is a gain device that has line amps working on different frequency ranges, which can be put into the "gain device" catagory too.
As a matter of fact, the right amount of compression can help a bass to sound more solid and cut through the mix (live or on record) with better sustain while not sacrificing nuances in the playing. Look at it this way: with the compressor's output gain increased a little (say 3dB) after compressing the signal peaks (for 3dB too), the loudest notes stay the same while excessively weak notes get boosted to be audible in the mix.
From my experience in the studio, a Rickenbacker bass or basses in the "neck-through" variety need less compression than the bolt-on ones like Fender basses as the former has better sustain and note saturation.
From this recording engineer/producer's point of view, "effects" include: reverb, echo, delay, chorus, flanger, phaser, ADT(auto double track), etc, which are all delay-based.
Compressor/limiter, gate/expander can be put into the "gain device" catagory whose VCA (voltage controlled amplifier) controls the device' output level.
EQ is a gain device that has line amps working on different frequency ranges, which can be put into the "gain device" catagory too.
As a matter of fact, the right amount of compression can help a bass to sound more solid and cut through the mix (live or on record) with better sustain while not sacrificing nuances in the playing. Look at it this way: with the compressor's output gain increased a little (say 3dB) after compressing the signal peaks (for 3dB too), the loudest notes stay the same while excessively weak notes get boosted to be audible in the mix.
From my experience in the studio, a Rickenbacker bass or basses in the "neck-through" variety need less compression than the bolt-on ones like Fender basses as the former has better sustain and note saturation.
-
shamustwin
- Senior Member
- Posts: 5287
- Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2003 5:00 am
In studio, my band (http://www.shamustwins.com)uses a tuner. Live, it's by ear. I never know what amp, cab, or effect(s) I'll use at a live gig until I'm packing up the car. I like the element of unpredictability, it's very rock and roll to me.
I was in a studio in Germany in 1981 and the engineer did some phasing for us by using two playback tape decks and slightly slowing one down for a split second, he had to try several times to get it right and he had some technique in which he put his shoulder against the side of the tape reel, is this still done Paul, or is this a lost art in the digital age? It sounded great.
This trick may have been what is known as flanging and is an effect available via analog or digital effects unit or by controlling the speed of analog tape by leaning on the tape spool or flange.. thus the term.
There are conflicting stories as to the origin of the term flanging. The Beatles book on their studio sessions implies the term emerged within the confines of those sessions, but I have read the term originated by engineers pressing on the tape spool or "flange"to control the tape speed during mixing to add the effect. Supposedly this was discovered quite by accident and was first used on a record in the late 50's or very early '60s.
There are conflicting stories as to the origin of the term flanging. The Beatles book on their studio sessions implies the term emerged within the confines of those sessions, but I have read the term originated by engineers pressing on the tape spool or "flange"to control the tape speed during mixing to add the effect. Supposedly this was discovered quite by accident and was first used on a record in the late 50's or very early '60s.