Can anyone ID what kind of Ric this HS is off ?

stevebasshead · Post by **stevebasshead** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 2:26 pm

Thanks for your help so far, and I've some more information for you. I was wrong about the shoes not being magnetized, now that I've tried installing it and had a closer check I can confirm the shoes are indeed and the bobbin/polepieces aren't. Unfortunately the mounting holes in the aluminium base are a different size to the 4003 bridge pickup's and I only have 1 screw in my spares tray that is the right thread size...and the shops are closed! So I've no idea yet what this pickup actually sounds like.

However, since it was described as a "Vintage Rickenbacker Horseshoe 4-string bass guitar pickup, tested & working, meters at 7.6k." and turns out to actually be from a lap steel I'm thinking I need to contact the eBay dealer. This pickup is presumably going to sound quite different to the bass version, isn't it ?

Alternatively, I guess I could use my 4003's bobbin but I'd have to remove the bar magnet from the bobbin (if I understand a posting on the Rickenbacker Forum from John Hall correctly.) How would I do that, I couldn't see how it was attached, is it glued ? For easy reference his posting is here and worth a read http://www.rickenbacker.com/forum_view_message.asp?forum=Just_Basses&message_id=24023&thread_id=2255&thread_name=4001c64s????&p=p#24023

So...then all I'd have to worry about it seems is whether the shoes need re-energising and what differences there are between the windings on a standard 4003 bobbin and the original 60's 4001 version. Does anyone know what the difference would be ?

Sorry for all the questions in my first ever posting here, but I do appreciate your help !

thx1955 · Post by **thx1955** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 2:33 pm

Thanks John !!!

Stephen,
No need to apologise for asking questions, one of the things that makes this place great is the wealth of knowledge of the members and their willingness to share the same.

wints · Post by **wints** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 2:39 pm

Stephen,

The original windings on the 60's basses run about 7.4K on average, but were hand or "scatterwound". They have a softer, subtle tone.

The newer 4003 bobbins are far hotter\louder and run anywhere up to 14K from what we have seen.

Here's an original 60's bass bobbin with the correct four polepieces.

headbanger · Post by **headbanger** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 3:13 pm

You'll find bass strings won't fit through the gap between the coil & the magnets on the 8 string. eg It was made for much thinner strings.
IMHO an 8 string lapsteel pickup can't be represented as a bass pickup by a long stretch.

johnallg · Post by **johnallg** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 4:14 pm

Steven, welcome. If the shoes will fit in the bridge chrome surround, you could make a new aluminum base and use the bridge pup from a 4003. Unwinding it to around 7.8 - 8k and putting the .0047uF cap in the circuit as the 4001 basses had should get you very close. Sergio could also scatterwind a pickup for you.

As to a recourse against the seller, depends on what you paid for it. I would think you could go for the difference of what a lap steel horseshoe goes for and what a 4001 horseshoe has been going for.

dale_fortune · Post by **dale_fortune** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 4:38 pm

Doc Pettillo isn't the most reputable Ebay seller

stevebasshead · Post by **stevebasshead** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 5:06 pm

Guys, thanks for the welcomes, this is certainly a really helpful place !

The shoes do indeed fit in the existing 4003 chrome surround and I've already done the cap mod a while back so I'm edging closer to my goal.

Can anyone can confirm whether, since the shoes have turned out to be magnetized, I will need to remove the bar magnet from underneath my existing bridge pickup's bobbin ? If so then having it unwound and putting the two together (plus any refund of the difference from the dealer - Dale, your comment gives me cause for concern but I'll give the eBay dealer the chance to do the decent thing) might be the nearest to a win-win situation that I'll get.

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 5:30 pm

(courtesy JPS)

ajish4 · Post by **ajish4** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 5:48 pm

Welcome Stephen,

Welcome to the HS addicts club.

I know EXACTLY what you are going through. I am a HS & Toaster addict myself. I love that combo, to me, that's the traditional or classic RIC setup, IMHO that is...

I know this has been beaten to death (probably second only to the 4005 RI topic) and I regret having to ask AGAIN, but is there ANY NEWS about the POSSIBILITY of RIC selling these again as replacements?

That would make me a happy (while poorer) man!

Anyone?

johnallg · Post by **johnallg** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:09 pm

Stephen, since the shoes are magnetized, the magnet under the 4003 pup comes off - it is just superglued on; I used a razor knife blade to get under it and split it off - it comes off whole with a little even force.

As to unwinding, that is something you could do with a little care and an ohmmeter. Pull off a couple hundred turns, strip the end, measure, and continue till you end up where you want to. You start to get a feel for how many turns will lower the reading so many ohms.

Very early ones were around 6k, 6.8k is another version, the toaster's are 7.4k, and 8 k is also a good sounding stopping point.

thx1955 · Post by **thx1955** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 6:27 pm

Thanks for the pic Jared, I knew I'd seen it somewhere.

stevebasshead · Post by **stevebasshead** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:36 am

Outstanding, thanks guys. And Tony, yes, it's a bit of a holy grail getting a HS isn't it ? I've a scatterwound 6-pole toaster and the cap mod...I'm almost there...almost...

In a strange way I'm glad Ric don't sell HS's off the shelf, there's a 'thrill of the chase' element that would disappear if they did.

ajish4 · Post by **ajish4** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:44 am

"there's a 'thrill of the chase' element that would disappear if they did."

LoL! I hear ya Steve, but you know what? I'll save the "thrill" for seeking WHOLE basses!

The MONEY I've spent just trying to put one together is just insane! And that's just for ONE!

I want one for my 4003 Monty, and for my Fretless when it comes in. And POSSIBLY one more! I have a Chris Squire and a V63 now, and they are my hands down favorites!

I'm so far gone, I've actually THOUGHT of getting a C64, taking the HS out and re-selling it with a High gain in it. Insane? YES, but I'd PROBABLY take LESS of a hit that way, than trying to put one together from Ebay!

Gimme a HS and a toaster, and I'm a happy man!

ken_j · Post by **ken_j** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 4:15 am

Welcome to the forum Stephen.

I sold Marc Seligman a set of horse shoes of a '68 a couple of years ago that needed re-gaussing. He mounted a 4003 pickup in it with the bar magnet intact, if I recall correctly. Maybe he could comment on whether there is enough clearance for the strings. Although this would get you the look but probably not the sound

stevebasshead · Post by **stevebasshead** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:00 am

Tony - if HS addiction is insanity then wrap me up in its warm cossetting straight jacket !

Ken - I had a look last night when I took the existing pickup out and I think there's clearance but I'd be interested to hear from Marc, thanks for the advice.