Downtuned muddiness

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:29 am

"and I didn't mention vintage SVT once"
Hey, I got an idea... haha!
Seriously you need speakers that will go down to about 34-35 hz which is LOW if you want to reproduce the fundamental which most people who play these don't. The ampeg 4 x 10 may though at a reduced volume, you'll get more overtones than anything with most speakers, any amp will reproduce sounds that low, your speakers are your limiting thing.

incubus2432 · Post by **incubus2432** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:14 am

www.acmebass.com

Not all 2x10"s are created equal. The only downside is that you need about 750 watts per 2x10" to get a usable volume in a loud band setting. I can't wait to get another pair though.....just incredible. Beats any 15" or 18" cabinet that I have heard.....from brutal lows to crisp highs.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:32 am

Yeah, they are quicker, very inefficient though. They don't spread the sound around like an 8 x 10 or even a 4 x 10 either. When I say get an 18" I mean with a 4 x 10 or something like that, maybe even a 2 x 10.

gearhed289 · Post by **gearhed289** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:37 am

A bigger cab for sure, and medium to heavy gauge strings should do the trick. I used that tuning years ago, but it was on a 35'' scale Modulus.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 8:28 am

If you detune more that E flat you need heavier strings ...

I used to like a DGCF tuning until I needed a low D flat so I went with a 5 string bass ...

teeder · Post by **teeder** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 8:53 am

I use D flat quite a bit on both my V63's. It's starting to get loose, but still sounds good with a lack of farting.
Light gage GHS Boomers with an Ampeg B2RE and 2X10 and 1X15 cabs.
I play behind the Horsey, which may have something to do with it, too.

thisismusicinc · Post by **thisismusicinc** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 10:55 am

I use D'addario EXL230 (55-75-90-110) strings on my 4003, and tune it CGCF. It works alright, but GHS has a 50-70-95-115 set that I think I will try out soon. Haven't tried to tune it up to normal though, I have a 4001 for that.

blueflamerick · Post by **blueflamerick** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 11:11 am

Joshua, I have one of my Ric 2030 basses tuned C-G-C-F and use the same set of strings Jon just mentioned. EXL230. No problems with muddiness out of an Ashdown MAG 300 combo amp.

aceonbass · Post by **aceonbass** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:00 pm

One thing is for certain, if you keep tuning the same set of strings up and then down that far, they will lose their tone and ability to produce a stable pitch real fast. The first four strings of a 5 string set tuned C F A# D#, a five string bass conversion, or two basses are the only good solutions to the problem.

markbass99 · Post by **markbass99** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:27 pm

"a five string bass conversion, or two basses are the only good solutions to the problem".

Listen to the man, he speaketh the truth. I really like the 4004 conversion principle, RIC made the fretboard nice and wide while keeping it very flat on the back. They also put just enough taper in the neck that the strings spread is good enough at the bridge to play finger style, barely.
Combine the very strong HB1 pickups with a room rattling B string and you can see that RIC missed an opportunity to put a decent five string out there on the playing field.

The conversion process isn't too bad, you could almost say that it's so easy a caveman could do it(if you know a few tricks). Here's a tip for someone thinking about it, get a solid color Laredo so you can have to top holes plugged and moved back about 3/4", then refinished(jetglo would be perfect). Or you can do it the way I did and and enjoy some caveman-like engineering....

.

mikes123 · Post by **mikes123** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:35 am

When I play sabbath tunes I detune a step and a half to C# I use heavy gauge strings and 15" speakers so the bottom end is still firm

alan · Post by **alan** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:10 pm

Whenever I finally get my 4004, I'd consider this crazy 4 to 5 conversion. Anyway, these answers make sense, it's a tricky problem to say the least.

henry5 · Post by **henry5** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 11:05 pm

Bear in mind the Steve Harris strings are flatwound.....if you use roundwounds you may just want to up your string gauge instead.

markbass99 · Post by **markbass99** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:58 am

I just want to say for the benefit of anyone considering a five string conversion on a 4004 that the ONLY B string I have been happy with so far is the LaBella Hard Rocking Steel B in .128 gauge. I've tried S.I.T., DR's, Daddario's in .120-.130 gauges and they either were floppy or if they weren't floppy they had weak tone. Maybe I'm just ultra picky but it didn't make any sense to me to go through the conversion process and suffer with substandard results even if that string isn't used very often. And at a cost of $10-$14 dollars a string it wasn't a cheap process either since I tried taper and non-taper cored strings. I haven't tried GHS, Ernie Ball, or LaBella flat wound B's because once I tried the HRS's I knew I had found "the string". My other four strings are DR Hi Beams, I'm very satisfied with those and they match up to the HRS very well.

johnallg · Post by **johnallg** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:09 am

Good info, Mark. Thanks for sharing your experience.