Vintage pickup option

bassduke49 · Post by **bassduke49** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 8:05 am

Decisions, decisions . . . I just ordered my fifth Rick, a Montezuma Brown 4003, and was asked if I wanted the standard pickups or the Vintage pickup options. The extra money (?) is not a problem, but my retailer mentioned that the total output with the Vintage pickups is not as great as the standard Hi-Gains. I understand that, but I'm not going to be playing in any band that needs deafening volume anyway (hell, I'm 54 years old and look nothing like Flea). So my question is, would the addition of the Vintage pickups enhance or reduce the "value" (collectibility) of the bass? I prefer the look of the toaster, and don't mind the horseshoe (I usually leave the bridge pickup cover on my other basses). What do you guys think?

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 8:25 am

it may not increase it's value ... but it won't hurt it either ... it all depends on the buyer ...

Now if you put the Seymour Duncan humbuckers in that will make it worth less ...

Ric makes some nice pickups, toasters, horseshoes, high gains, hb1's ... it's hard to go wrong with any of them ...

ricosound · Post by **ricosound** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 8:25 am

Paul,
If you need more output, turn it up! I don't think the VP option gets you the Horseshoe, just the Toaster neck PU. Here's a picture of a "VP" hanging in a local store. See, no horseshoe.
http://www.williesguitars.com/Pages/turq4003cl.html

If the toaster is too dim, adjust the PU closer to the strings relative to the treble PU. Also spring for the silver case upgrade, it's worth it.

ojobob2 · Post by **ojobob2** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 9:02 am

IMHO it all about the look of it. The Toaster looks nicer. My 70's 4001 has an original toaster pickup - lower output - but i cant tell the sound apart from a high gain. As the new toasters are stronger, id only buy one for the look of it

wwittman · Post by **wwittman** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 10:18 am

i cannot IMAGINE not being able to tell the difference in sound.
To me, the original toasters or the scatterwound reissues sound SO much clearer, bigger and BETTER.
The difference in level is easily compensated for at the amp, but the sound difference is great.
On the other hand, the "vintage pick-up" option on a bass does not get you the Horsehoe treble pick-up.
Only the V's and C's have that. (also well worth it for tone, in my opinion)

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 10:50 am

I had two V63's and have a 72 4001FL, to me the toasters are boomier sounding, but I think that has something to do with the pickup placement as I had a 75 4001 with a high gain in the old postition and it too sounded boomy, not much different than a toaster to me, I liked the sound actually.
but keep in mind that they are all different, one of my V63 toasters was very powerful, the other one was weak and my 72 has a strong one, it's hard to generalize about a pickups' sound as there are so many other variables.

rickenbrother · Post by **rickenbrother** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 11:36 am

Bassduke49 said: "hell, I'm 54 years old and look nothing like Flea.

LOL, Isn't that a good thing ?!?

jps · Post by **jps** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 1:17 pm

Regarding the C Series McCartney bass, if this is supposed to reproduce what he did to his bass it is incorrect. Didn't Paul replace his horseshoe with a hi gain pickup?

bigbajo60 · Post by **bigbajo60** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 1:33 pm

From what I understand, it's a reproduction of McCartney's bass as it is today... replaced horseshoe and all.

jps · Post by **jps** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 4:55 pm

It looks like it has a horseshoe in it though, so it is not truly representative of what he plays.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Tue Dec 16, 2003 5:46 pm

McCartney's 4001 went back to Ric for repairs ... the horseshoe was demagnitized Ric put what is essentially a modern high gain in it ... similar to a 4003 high gain ...

jps · Post by **jps** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:27 am

That's what I thought. So the 4001C64S doesn't really represent his bass as it is today.

admin · Post by **admin** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 2:38 am

Jps: Yes you are correct. The C Series, of course, reflects the features of the instruments as they left the factory originally.

This is, at least in my view, the most sensible and authentic approach as artists continue to make changes to their instruments. The number of possible combinations of features would be hard to keep up with. One of several classic examples of how complicated things can get is that of Lennon's 1958 325 Capri.

Your comment begs a most interesting question. What era does one choose when deciding on the features of a reissue? An interesting dilemma.

rogerf · Post by **rogerf** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 3:33 am

Jeffrey,

According to the Ric website and some posts from the time of announcement, the 4001C64S bass represents exactly what McCartney's bass is at present day. The most recent pictures of his Ric bass in the Bacon-Day Bass book and the Beatles Gear book seem to confirm that statement. The 4001C64S does not, however, represent his bass from the mid '70s Wings period. John Hall said he made one replica of the Wings bass for the Linda McCartney TV special and would not make any more.

As far as the lineage of pickup changes, it has been said that the original horseshoe pickup and surround was replaced in the mid '70s with a custom wound high gain pickup and a '70s rectangular pickup surround. Sometime in the last several years that replacement high gain pickup was removed and replaced with a new horseshoe pickup; the rectangular '70s metal pickup surround was reused and is still on the bass.

squirebass · Post by **squirebass** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 5:55 am

William Wittman wrote:
"On the other hand, the "vintage pick-up" option on a bass does not get you the Horsehoe treble pick-up."
Oh Really? I was under the impression that if you ordered the vintage pickup option you had to take both pickups. Mike Parks site specifies that "all pickups must be upgraded" so I assumed if I ordered one with the Vintage Pickup option, it would come with toaster and horseshoe...
Are you sure about that, William? I think I have seen some recent basses with the VP option that had toaster and horseshoe...