I'm new here. I have a technical question.

[2112]

First off, I'm new at this site. Looks like a great Rickenbacker place. I'm a big Rush and Yes fan, been playing bass since 1981 and own four Rickenbackers.
They are:
1980 4001 Burgandyglo
1981 4001 Jetglo
1984 4080/12 doubleneck Jetglo
1991 4001V63CS #15 of 1000.

Here's the question I have.
How did Geddy Lee install the Grover "S" tuning machines on his Rickenbackers. I have a set that will not fit on the headstock of any of mine. I mean they go through the holes, but the shaft of the tuning machine is not long enough so that the threads of the nut that is installed on the top can grab on to it for more than one turn. And that is if I don't use the washer. I have looked at as many photos of Geddy Ricks and the one thing that I notice is that I think the shaft of his tuners is a bit longer, thus letting the threads grab on and tighten properly. It's not a big deal if I don't use these, but I have been wondering about this for about 20 years now. Anyone?

Merry Christmas.

[admin]

Welcome to the RickResource Forum and Merry Christmas. A very good question. I believe the shaft on Geddy's was longer but I will leave you to the bass gurus who may have done this. One thing I do know from reading posts here. If you have the bass, time and talent, there is a remedy for all things Rickenbacker.

Please register your Rickenbackers once you get the chance.

[rickenbrother]

Peter, I think you are right about the shafts of the tuners Geddy used being longer.

[nattiep]

Ah, so they are M4S tuners then. Good, I have a set that I'm putting on my bass. Hopefully they're long enough.

I'm a big Rush nut too, so you'll be welcomed here.
I only have one bass though. A '76 4001 JG.

[jps]

Welcome!

The earlier headstocks were thinner so that may explain it.

[rickaddict]

Somebody needs to score a really good photo of Geddy's headstock. Its hard to tell the Grover Titans from the Schaller M4S's. The Grovers look almost identical except that they have a little bit of a twist to the ends of the keywinds, sorta like the Grover propeller tuners (Wavy Grovers).

I have a '73 4001 that came (to me) with Grover Titans. Their tuner posts are not only long enough, they're actually a bit too long as the D string rattles a bit in the nut.

But there are a couple other variables in the equation here: Some Rick basses have thinner headstocks than others. My '73's headstock is a relatively thin one. And the tilt angle on the headstock changed over the years as well. The earlier ones had little if any tilt. I think it was in '73 when the appearance of the headstock changed very slightly that the headstock got the back tilt.

So try to take that into account when you're making a Geddy tribute bass. If those big tuner posts put the string higher off the face of the headstock than the stock tuners you might run into problems with your strings rattling in the nut. That's why you see some early Ricks with the big post tuners installed that then needed a string tree to keep the string(s) from rattling in the nut.

Sometimes unfortunately solving one problem(exploding wavy Grovers), created another problem: --strings buzzing in the nut.

[dswp]

HHHMMMMM

[jps]

You can make that out? You have incredible vision, Dave!!!

[rickenbrother]

The headstock thickness does not vary much on my 4001's, though the headstock tilt does. My 4003's have thicker headstocks.

[ben_brown]

That certainly clears things up Dave!

[2112]

Merry Christmas everyone!!

Well thanks for the replys so far. Hoping for more.
These tuning machines I'm talking about aren't those kinda cheezy ones that Rickenbacker sometimes installed on their basses. I know what ones some of you are referring to. The ones I am talking about are the same kind that were installed on some BC Rich basses in the late 70's or early 80's. Geezer Butler's BC Rich that he used on the Heaven and Hell and Mob Rules tours had these. They have an "S" shape when viewed from the side. Maybe theese are the ones. I mean, I have the set, but I just don't have a photo of mine. And this photo seems to be the ones. I've also included a photo of some Grover heads that look exactly like the ones I have but are for Fender.

[jps]

Those are Grover Titans. Back in the early '80s tuners similar to those made by Schaller, the M4S, were installed on my '67 4005WB. These have since been replaced by Hipshot Ultralite tuners that fit the larger post hole size. Some day I plan to put the proper Rickenbacker tuners back on.

[ken_j]

I have a '73 4001 that came (to me) with Grover Titans. Their tuner posts are not only long enough, they're actually a bit too long as the D string rattles a bit in the nut.

I would fabricate a spacer, possibly from a sheet of plastic,to put between the headstock and the tuners. If I recall correctly the tuners on a '70s skunk stripe bass I once owned had black plastics spacers from Rick. It also had black plastic tuner bushings.

[rickaddict]

Thomas P-

Yes, the photos of the tuners that you posted are the same tuners I was referring to in my earlier post.

[2112]

Yes, those are the ones.
Now, I just don't understand. Were there versions of them with longer shafts? I can't believe that the headstocks were that much thinner on the Ricks in the 70's than my 1980 or 1981 4001. This is really frustrating. Oh well, one of life's mystery's that probably only Geddy's bass tech that origionally installed them can explain.
Somebody locate him!