The Fakes Thread

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 1:49 pm

Saw a 4001 copy yesterday at the store where I got my Rickenbacker TR35B amplifier some months back.
It was being sold as a copy (for 300 Euro) though it had a genuine Rick raised-letter TRC and two high-gain pickups, probably from the late 70's. The bass, clearly emulating a mid-70's 4001, had a natural finish, a bolt-on neck with a very dark brown fretboard and one bass volume and one treble volume - no tone controls and no selector switch. I suspect this to be a non-original control layout. Tuners were 'wavy' button Grover copies, and only a single, mono jack socket was provided. The handrest was missing. No indication as to country of manufacture or brand, though I believe the thing to be japanese-made.
As for its sound, well, what a monster - pure Rickenbacker tone! The pickups were hot and perfectly balanced.
I'm considering buying this one 4001 copy just for the hell of it - I've seen many Rick copies in my time, but never owned one. I'll let you all if I go ahead and pick it up.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 6:51 am

Hm... That last sentence should read "I'll let you all know if...".

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Mon Dec 22, 2003 12:38 pm

This one is an Ibañez. Not an exact 4001 copy, though.

atomic_punk · Post by **atomic_punk** » Wed Dec 24, 2003 6:43 am

Sergio, are you going to leave it stock (well, as is...) or are you going to put Rick pickups in it and see what it sounds like? What are the ones in it? Were all of the Ibanez's made that way? I seem to remember them having a similar p/u/ config as the Ricks. I had a Univox in the early 80's that had the worst action ever on a bass. Nothing I could do to fix it either. I sold it to my little brother.

(evil grin).

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed Dec 24, 2003 8:44 am

That looks like an Fenderbacker EB-0 copy to me, or is that a 70's Tele bass humbucker in there?
Steve I don't think that's the one Sérgio is going to buy.
The Ibinez's I've seen looked a lot like Ric's with the same type of pickups as Rics, someone butchered a butcher job here I think.

ojobob2 · Post by **ojobob2** » Wed Dec 24, 2003 10:13 am

Nah Bruce Foxton of the Jam had an Ibanez copy just like that

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Wed Dec 24, 2003 10:21 am

The Ibañez pictured above was on Ebay. Like I said, the one I'm contemplating buying has no brand. I would never buy the Ibañez above. If I were to buy a 4001 copy I would look for one cosmetically close to a real Rick bass, which the Ibañez clearly is not.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 12:17 pm

Here's another japanese-made 4001 copy.

cheyenne · Post by **cheyenne** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 12:54 pm

I saw one in a shop a year or so ago, it was black with checker binding and it looked real, the weight was even right. Could be wrong but I think it was a Univox.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:17 pm

It probably was. Some 4001 copies were fairly accurate renditions of the real thing. Not too long ago Paul Yan kindly e-mailed me some pics of a great-looking Greco 4001 copy made in the early 80's. This was on Ebay at the time, I think. I remember one of us saying that this copy looked so good that if RIC would come out with a 4003 like that it would please many Rick aficionados! I still have those pics. Can't post them here due to their size, though, but I can send them to you, Scott. Watch your e-mail box.

paul_yan · Post by **paul_yan** » Sat Dec 27, 2003 3:38 pm

Here she is, the Greco 4001 copy.
I gotta say she's a beauty!
Her neck has black bindings.
Too bad she's got only one truss rod.

I bid $500 on her but was outbid ($510) in the last 10 seconds.

The seller was in Japan and his description was an interesting read too:
-----------------------------------
You are looking at a really cool and really vintage Greco Bass! Greco was one of Japan's famous (or infamous) Ibanez/Gibson lawsuit copy makers in the late 70’s / early 80’s. Excellent wood choice and matching on this guitar which is rare these days. Very similar to the original company's quality...Simply amazing! You may not realize how rare these are, but they are very high-end, and sold for a whopping 90,000 yen way back then even. You can tell it is very high-end just by looking at it.
Japanese quality-control is of the highest standards and this guitar is a testimonial to that work ethic. You simply won't play a cooler Bass or one that better copies the original. The woods chosen are of the highest quality I’ve seen on anything that has been made in and around the time that this one was. Jumbo frets, and the neck is set and perfectly straight. Nice thick rosewood fingerboard, too. This guitar has all the right tones, replicating the original EXACTLY. This is a not-for-export high-end Greco. I'd say the guitar is medium/heavy weight for a bass, as it weighs 9.5 lbs. Stunning maple neck, laquered rosewood fingerboard is very quick and overall, this is a gorgeous bass. This guitar is in 8.5/10 VG++ condition. WOW tone (how they got such good tone, I have NO idea!), endless sustain, one of the sweetest basses you'll ever play. Just look back through my feedback – I have never had one of these before because they are virtually non-existent anymore, but DANG, they are nice basses for a serious rocker who is looking for TONE and good bang-for-the-buck. You will not get better pickups of similar design from any other company aside the original. She is ready to thump and needs nothing.
-----------------------------------------

Guitar Specifications & Features
----------------------------------------

* 1984 Greco Lawsuit Bass.
* Serial Number: I841174
* Weight of guitar: 9.5 lbs.
* Width of nut: 1 7/16 inch
* Scale Length: 34.00 in.
* 8.5/10 VG++ - Blue Book of Electric Guitars Condition Rating
* 100% Original
* Cool aged vintage white finish
* Inlays are incredible!
* Almost no fret wear (95% good) at all on this beautiful, thin neck (Jumbo Frets, too)
*
* Original tuners keep the guitar in tune very well
* Only Released in Japan, This Model Never Exported!
* Very Resonant, Sweet Tone From Ibanez Original Iceman series pickups
* 1-Piece Solid Mahogany Body and Mahogany Neck (Neck-thru Design)
* Gorgeous, thin contoured C-shaped Mahogany Neck with Nice slab rosewood fingerboard
* Longer Neck Tenon
* Very high quality routing and unmatched craftsmanship in its price range
* Sold new in the 1984 for 90,000 yen.
* Incredible Sustain, Tone, and Playability – this bass will knock ‘em out with tone!
* Includes soft case. Sorry, the hard case in the picture is not included.

------------------------------------------

Known Problems or Issues With Bass
-------------------------------------------

* It is missing the bridge pickup cover, which is usually taken off by players because it gets in the way... has a few light ding impressions on back and a few scratches around the body, but for a 1984 replica, WOW, she is gorgeous!
-----------------------------------------------

These guitars are truly spectacular, beautiful, inspirational instruments, and you can turn your friends' faces green with envy when you tell them how little you paid for such a great instrument.
For more info. On Greco Guitars, you can visit this Japanese-only website (if your browser can decode Kanji) and click around to find out more about Grecos and see some pictures:
http://grecomania.hp.infoseek.co.jp/

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:55 am

Here's another obvious 4001 copy.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Wed Dec 31, 2003 8:16 am

How much is 90,000 Yen in dollars Paul?
And that's a nice looking copy Sérgio.
The only things that look a little strange to me are the neck inlays and the neck wood, i don't have a bass with a thumbrest so i don't know the correct position for them. the treble pickup is also a little square looking. Nice checkerboard, looks nice on MG's, Er, I mean naturals.
Lot of glare though that could hide a mulitiude of sins.

paul_yan · Post by **paul_yan** » Wed Dec 31, 2003 9:31 pm

Bob,
In January 1984, 90,000 Yen equalled $388.551 USD. Today, it's $838.457 USD.

Here's a currency converter at your service:
http://www.oanda.com/converter/classic

bigbajo60 · Post by **bigbajo60** » Wed Dec 31, 2003 9:41 pm

Happy New Year to one and all!!!

Here's the latest candidate for review by the sharp eyes here at the forum:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2369931660

The seller isn't sure, but I think this might be a set-neck 4000-S that has been "hot-rodded"... it's got the wavy-key, deluxe-style tuners and the S-style non-bound body... a Rickenbacker TRC...

What say you, the sharper-of-eye than me?