Biggest Competitor

philco · Post by **philco** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:30 pm

I was just wondering who RIC might consider their main competitor in the marketplace. Any ideas?

mortivan · Post by **mortivan** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 3:22 pm

Hmm. Everything RIC is so unique. I always considered them a "niche market" with a huge niche.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:17 pm

Yeah I kind of agree with John, they really have no competition because their stuff is so unique and different, (was that a Yogi Berra?)

philco · Post by **philco** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:16 pm

Niche market is probably right. The big mass producers consider RIC no competition, and RIC could say the same about them. Midsize bass specialists like Ernie Ball, Spector and Warwick compete against each other, but they sell active basses almost exclusively, and passive-only Rickenbacker isn't lumped in with that crowd either. Small custom builders like Ken Smith and Status Graphite are blips on the screen even to RIC.

I did an eBay search the other day. There were over 500 Fender basses listed. The highest ANY other manufacturer could muster was something like 76. There were a couple dozen Ricks or so. Fender is/was at least 7 times bigger than it's next nearest competitor, if eBay is an accurate indicator.

I would say that in the past few years, Fender hasn't maintained such a commanding lead, wouldn't you both agree? The internet and places like Harmony Central and BGRA are opening player's minds to the diversity of excellent basses out there. Fender, Gibson, and Rickenbacker were the only common bass names around when I got my first P-bass in 1976. That was the year Leo's new StingRay appeared, and others followed quickly in it's wake. Spector was born around then also, with Ibanez and the other imports growing like a weed. If I could only call up basses built in the last 5 years, the eBay stats would be a lot different. I mean, who ever once considered that a company like Schecter would have one of the nicest basses around for well under $1000 MSRP? Fender did NOT win a lot of awards in the last Bass Player Mag showdown. The $500 to $1000 MSRP category is hotly contested territory, most of the decent new gig basses sold are in that price range (if the local music stores are any indication), most are foreign made, and most of them would blow away my '75 P-bass in build quality.

Ed Roman flamed Schecter, so I checked their bass reviews and the Stiletto series had about the highest rating at that price range that I ever saw. I read many reviews and found only one negative review, probably based on a malfunctioning active circuit. Their custom shop competes against his, and he can't undercut other internet dealers on Schecter prices. I have to remember to thank him some day for leading me to some good discoveries based on his flaming rants.

Sakes alive, is there ever some competition out there outside the RIC camp!

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 9:17 pm

Their competition is other high end basses ...

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 9:50 pm

Phil: I have a Schecter C-5 ... excellent bass ... nice look ... nice feel ... nice tone ... nice action ... nice price ... I still prefer my 4003s5 though ...

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 12:57 am

Well since RIC doesn't make 12 string'ers (except for SurfRat's) I'll say Hamer...

Until they make one for me!

eatswodo · Post by **eatswodo** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 9:34 am

From a purely guitar viewpoint, I would say that Gretsch is about the only manufacturer out there that occupies the same kind of niche as Rickenbacker. However, all their instruments are now made offshore, AFAIK. I'd be very surprised if RIC regards them as a competitor.

rickengrowl · Post by **rickengrowl** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:13 am

I contribute to some bass-related boards, and the most common dilemma I see is : StingRay or 4003 ?

In another hand, given that RICs are hand-crafted, they better should be compared to other hand-crafted instruments. Generally these instruments are way more pricey than standard RICs. But all these basses (including RIC) have much personality, and trying to find a "competition" between RIC and other basses (MTD ? F-Bass ? Sadowsky ? ...) is like trying to find a competition between Coca-Cola and Nike...

And finally, as stated before, the RIC tone is unique. No other bass sounds like one. On this point, RIC has no challenger.

Cheers,
JL

jmh · Post by **jmh** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 2:57 pm

>Phil: I have a Schecter C-5 ... excellent bass ... nice look ... nice feel ... nice tone ... nice action ... nice price ... I still prefer my 4003s5 though ...

I have a Schecter Stiletto Elite 4, great build quality, look, feel, action, price. But the G string sounds different than the others, on several of these basses I've tried. I wish I could make it sound more like a F****r bass.

philco · Post by **philco** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 3:19 pm

Jack, my ReBop sounds close enough to a P-bass when using the neck pickup solo. I can also get close to a StingRay sound. Must be the Aguilar preamp, it's known for warmth. Plug into an Aguilar DB-924 outboard preamp if you have EMG-HZ pickups on the Elite 4. It's the same preamp circuit as the older ReBop has, and you should get a P-bass sound from the neck pickup. I believe your Elite 4 has the EMG preamp that the Spector Professional series has. If you replace it with an Aguilar OBP-1 onboard preamp or Aguilar DB-924 outboard preamp, you will be upgrading to ReBop circuitry. The ReBop has a proprietary Spector circuit this year, but the Aguilar preamp was on earlier models. The Aguilar preamps are warm sounding, so maybe that's what gets the P-bass tone on my ReBop. It also has an alder body like a P-bass, and a bolt-on maple neck. I'm not surprised it gets a P-bass tone.......and a lot of others.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 3:29 pm

Sometimes Ric's biggest competition is their lack of presence in music stores ...

I wish the local guitar center in Canton MI would stock Ric basses ... they could move 15 to 20 basses a year if they were stocked ...

philco · Post by **philco** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 4:47 pm

Whoever the competition is, they don't keep RIC from staying behind on orders.

I read an article on the MTD website that said the market for $4K basses was getting weaker and customers were moving downscale a bit. Probably why RIC does so well and why Spector is pumping up their Euro bass line. Ernie Ball came out with the S.U.B. as a lower cost alternative to the StingRay. The high end is a slow and steady market, and it is probably oversaturated with production right now. I suspect a lot of formerly high end customers are buying in the $1K to $2K range right now. After they buy a couple of custom prestige basses, it's time to muck around with the cheaper stuff again. The difference between a $1K-$2K bass and a $4K bass is mostly just looks anyway. RIC offers a buyer considerable prestige/vintage look/unique tone for not a lot of money. I noticed that most Rick bass owners still own or did own or will own almost every other brand under the sun besides their Rick, so they were not expecting it to be like anything else it seems.

I guess RIC could counter with a 6500 bass as a lower cost alternative to a 4003/4004 if buyers started going downscale to imports. I see the overall flood of excellent import basses at $500 to $1000 street price as the competition, and not any one particular brand. I have to admit that some of those import basses are really good.

rob · Post by **rob** » Sun Jan 04, 2004 7:38 pm

I don't think Rickenbacker needs to compete. When's the last time you saw an advertisement in a magazine like Bass Player or Guitar Player?

I think the name sells itself. That's what makes them so unique.

marc61 · Post by **marc61** » Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:58 am

I would think Ric's competition are the basses the players who are known for using ric's switch too. Like Geddy Lee switching to a jazz bass.

You would be hard pressed however, to find an axe that has the combination of looks, quality and sound anywhere near the price range.