Biggest Competitor

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 7:53 am

Philip-

"check the Czechs" before buying tubes, guns, and guitars. Yes!!!

Now if a M60 is going for $6500, a MAG58 should be cheaper-if I can find one.

Love them JJ Kt88's, esp the blue ones.

philco · Post by **philco** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 8:57 am

Any good black market gun dealer in Vietnam or Cambodia should be able to help you out, Jared, as our troops ran into plenty of them in Vietnam and Cambodia. Guns are really durable and tend to change hands a few times during their lifetime. If I remember correctly, the MAG58 was based on the MG42, which was the premier hand carriable machine gun of WWII. Our special forces troops often carried high quality Czech weapons on covert missions (and still do) where deniability (denial ain't just a river in Egypt) is important and they could not be found carrying American or NATO weapons. The CZ75 is a favorite pistol of theirs, and I'm sure they still have a fondness for the MAG58 when they need to carry a "commie" gun.

As a matter of fact, a guy I know was once a "dealer in questionable goods" in southeast Asia for several years after he mustered out of the Marine Corps during the Vietnam war. He worked as a Marine sniper, so he probably knew of a few good gun runners. He's been out of the business for a long, long time, however. Basically, he says a little bit of money in Saigon gets you your answer and an invitation to shop. All the export and ownership problems are YOUR problem. You'll probably need more luck and savvy than money.

philco · Post by **philco** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 9:48 am

Still off the original subject, but the MAG58 was probably a Belgian FN design and later built by the Czechs, or maybe the other way around. It was probably the forerunner of our own FN Minimi design carried by U.S. forces. Military weapons manufacture can be confusing, and I got off the subject years ago. Case in point is the FN FAL, which was Belgian designed and built by FN in Belgium. It was licensed for manufacture in many other counries and was nicknamed "the right arm of the free world". The Britsh changed the design a bit and it became LAR or L1A1, I forget. The Canadians had another designation, C1A1 I believe. They were also built in Brazil, Argentina, Australia, Israel, and probably other places like India. I had a Brazilian made model named SAR4800, semi-auto only, and as accurate as a bolt action rifle. Gun designers borrow other designers' ideas, and this includes Czech weaponry (or tubes and basses, for that matter). Any successful military small arms weapon design tends to be produced in several locations. It takes a book just to explain all the FN FAL variants and subvariants. The AR15/M16 and its many variants and accessories available on the market also takes a book to catalog it all. Then military units often modify weapons to their liking. And you thought guitars/basses and all the different variants were confusing? HA!!!

Getting guitars and basses made in another country is child's play compared to setting up a weapons manufacturing facility, so anybody who does that with excellence can make other things as well.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 9:59 am

Phil ... you sure do type a lot ...

rob · Post by **rob** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 12:14 pm

He must be at work........

philco · Post by **philco** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 4:47 pm

Actually, I was once a bit of a gun collector and couldn't help reminiscing, but I've been selling them off lately to buy basses.

Most gun collecting nuts are seriously in need of a better hobby, in my opinion. A half dozen guns will do anybody (the average ownership rate is about 3.5 guns for every man, woman, and child in Texas). Advertisers keep the gun magazines going and gun writers keep the BS and hype flowing to keep the advertisers going. I noticed that almost every highly successful deer hunter in Arkansas had a semi-auto or lever action rifle with a low power scope, if any. They gave up on fancy bolt actions and mega-power scopes when they wised up, but look at what the gun mags push. Dan the Doctor and Larry the Lawyer show up with the Weatherby bolt action magnum rifles and 8X scopes for hunting in the woods. Ron the Redneck bags deer in the woods with a cheap Marlin lever action 30-30 that handles lightning quick. I know one guy that never got a deer with his fancy gun-writer-approved bolt action rifle with scope, then he picked up a cheap Chinese MAK-90 with 30-round magazine and got a deer every year. "I just point the thing at 'em and open up on 'em, 'cause every deer I ever saw was already running to beat hell during huntin' season"..... were his words to me....."I never saw a deer strike a pose for me at 200 yards like in those gun magazines come huntin' season time".

I could say things somewhat along those lines concerning music gear. Or fly fishing gear. Or stereos. Or whatever.

The guitar mags are just about as full of BS and hype as the gun mags, so I moved on. I can get all the guitar BS and hype I need for free on internet websites, like here. I'm finding that you can distill all that you really need in guitar gear down to a handful of really essential items. I'm thankful the collector phase died out in me before it really got going like it did with guns. I'm hoping it carries over into other areas as well.

After I buy that next bass.

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sun Jan 11, 2004 5:16 pm

I've been busy for a few days, how did a thread about competition to Rickencbacker turn into a thread about cheap basses and machine guns?
When I bought my first P bass in 1971, there was one P bass and one J bass, made in America, and they were still pretty good then, now there are about 500 models of P and J basses, and most of them are junk. I bought my first Ric bass in 1977, it was a great bass and the quality was good,and they are probably made even better now. What other guitar company can say that? I like Ric basses (all) and OLD Fenders, I'm partial to a lot of old basses as a matter of fact, but Ric is the only manufacturer that I know of that still makes them with the same quality that was standard thirty or forty years ago and that is now very hard to find. Maybe as someone here mentioned the vintage series Fenders might be good quality, but I had several new American deluxe Jazz and P basses several years back and Rics beat them in every way, very much so in fact, there was no comparison at all.
I am amazed at how many of these companies have sold out and make all this krap now, I like Daves point about how they are in trouble and do it to keep afloat, I've also seen old Hifi Companies do the same thing, even car companies. I also think that when a high end or even middle company makes cheap basses they ruin their reputation and their high end stuff will eventually go down the drain. I for one would hate to see a cheap Ric bass. They are quality made, and I know that when I buy one, new or second hand I'm going to get quality, and this is besides the fact that I love the sound, feel, and looks of them.
Even owning other basses, they will always be my main playing basses. When I buy a Ric I know what I'm getting, if I buy anything else I'm not certain.
When I go to see a band if I see a Ric, I know it's going to be a nice high quality bass. If I see a band with other types of basses, I never know if it is a Korean piece of krap or something made in Mexico, or whatever, with a Ric I KNOW what it is, and know I would want that bass and would love to play that bass.
I like the custom shop idea though.

atomic_punk · Post by **atomic_punk** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 5:30 am

Buy basses, not guns! When used properly, a bass can be just as effective!

bigbajo60 · Post by **bigbajo60** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 5:40 am

Wasn't there a story in Bass Player once upon a time about a bar fight where a bassist killed a guy?

Seems that the bassist swung his bass into his attackers belly and ruptured some vital internal organ!

So yeah... I guess the bass can be just as effectively lethal as a gun!

atomic_punk · Post by **atomic_punk** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:25 am

I came close to using my Hamer 12 string as a battering ram once, an overzealous (and overserved) male in the audience decided that he took a liking to our female guitarist and singer, telling her that she "was prrrrrrretty" and "sang nice" and then wanting us to play "OZZZZZZZZZZZZZYYYYYY!" Meanwhile, he came closer and closer to her mic stand, and I was waiting for security to do something, when they didn't, he grabbed her mic stand and off came the bass and he backed down. And people wonder why I wear the boots onstage!

m_cuffa · Post by **m_cuffa** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 7:58 am

Hmmm.. I guess if my life were threatened I'd be tempted to use my MIM P as a weapon, but I'd never, ever, swing my Ric in anger..

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 8:29 am

I smashed a bass on stage back in the 70's ... ala Pete Townsend ... scared the kids watching the band then I gave them all the pieces ... ahhh ... the good old days ... ohh ... it wasn't a ric ... it was a hofner copy ... no big loss ...

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 9:12 am

Hey does anybody remember that Hanna-Barbera cartoon "Quick Draw McGraw"? This guy (horse) predated Pete T by smashing his guitar (cartoon) over other characters' heads.

The alter ego was "El Kabong"

This was the original smashing act. In the 60's

IMHO

admin · Post by **admin** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 9:31 am

Jared. I don't know if I know what you mean.

jnbass · Post by **jnbass** » Mon Jan 12, 2004 9:42 am

That's the guy!

How do you find these things?!!