Construction and specs for higains

jturner97 · Post by **jturner97** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 4:56 am

i own a 360. i have recently been looking for specs on the higain pickups, but have found it hard to come across. I would like to know how they are constructed (magnetic polepieces or bar magnet, etc), what their resistance is, etc.

i just bought an older jazzmaster, as a live backup, and i am looking to replace the pickups so they sound more like my ric higains (which for me is the perfect tone). if i can find out that they were consructed w/o polepieces, i can rule out all fender and SD replacement pu's. if they do have polepieces, maybe the fender jazzmaster pickups would be best. perhaps dearmond would be worth looking into?

i play indie rock (ala cursive, yeah yeah yeahs, menomena, spoon), sometimes noise-rock.

does anyone have any insight in this matter? any recommendations?

thanks!

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 5:49 am

http://www.rickenbacker.com/pdf/gpickups.pdf

the high gain has a magnet base with iron slug pole pieces ...

doctorwho · Post by **doctorwho** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 8:51 am

Justin, I have four high-gains on which I can take resistance measurements when I get home from work tonight. I'll post the results here.

jturner97 · Post by **jturner97** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:21 pm

thanks alot! that will help very much. i would like to be able to figure out what kind of magnet it uses as well....alnico 2, etc. i suppose there are reasons ric is so secretive about their designs...

so a higain uses both a magnet and magnetic pole pieces? i was under the impression that fender mostly uses magnetic pole pieces, and gibson uses bar magnets, but the ric uses both?

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 1:45 pm

Secretive? I'm not going to hand you the prints but I'll answer any reasonable question.

The Hi Gain starts with a ferrite-filled rubber magnet at the bottom. The coil goes on top of that. The iron polepieces go through the center of the coil's bobbin and make contact with the magnet on their bottom tips.

Just don't ask me the Q or L of the pickups- that's something that was filed away decades ago and I'm not going looking for it. But that probably has more to do with the pickup's sound more than almost anything else.

jturner97 · Post by **jturner97** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 5:55 pm

thanks for the reply, john. i wasnt complaining about the elusiveness of the design....on the contrary, i love how most people outside of this forum and the ric community dont know the first thing about ric design. i was just commenting on how this is really the only place to ask these questions, i couldnt find a place on the rick website with higain specs (resistance and such).

anyways, thanks for the info!

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 8:21 pm

the pole pieces are not magnetized on a high gain ... but the reissue horseshoe pickup and the toaster pickups have alnico magnet pole pieces ... alnico is aluminum, nickel, and cobalt added to iron ...

johnhall · Post by **johnhall** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 6:32 am

This is probably just semantics but I believe technically a pole piece is an element which is used to extend or guide a magnetic field. The Hi Gain, therefore, has pole pieces in the form of slug screws, the HB in the form of blades, and the vintage horseshoe in the form of the horseshoes themselves.

For that reason, I'm not sure you can say the toaster has any polepieces, and similarly, the magnets in the horseshoe aren't polepieces.

Personally I don't care what you call them but I thought the distinction should be made so that the function of the polepiece is more apparent.

doctorwho · Post by **doctorwho** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 4:00 pm

Justin, here are the resistance readings for my four high gains:

from a 2003 620/6: neck, 11.6 kOhms; bridge, 12.3 kOhms

from a 2002 620/12: neck, 11.2 kOhms; bridge, 11.3 kOhms

adam_swapp · Post by **adam_swapp** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 7:23 pm

Speaking of high gains...

I just acquired a high gain to drop into the neck cavity on a 62 625 (11.8 kOhms, BTW). It doesn't fit in the stock cavity. There are two problems here:
- The magnet is too long for the cavity.
- The magnet is not mounted parallel with the centerline of the pickup. It's slightly angled. Therefore, when the magnet is aligned with the cavity, the pickup is not perpendicular to the strings. It's noticable, and it looks funny.

As a result, I will have to enlarge the cavity if I want to install this pickup in the proper orientation. Granted, it's not a huge enlargement: about 3/16" in length and 3/32" in width, but still...

Here are the questions: are all high gains made like this? Are they deliberately made to be non-symmetrical, is mine just somewhere within the tolerances, or is it a rogue unit that should have been caught?

I don't necessarily expect a new pickup to drop into a 40 year old body, but I would like to determine if additional routing is avoidable.

On a related note, how are humbuckers made? I need to rout a cavity for the bridge pickup. However, based on my experience with the high-gain, I am not at all confident that a cavity with the original dimensions will accomodate the humbucker I plan to install. Do the humbuckers have a similar rectangular projection below the body?

Making the determination about the humbucker is crucial to the progress of my project. Routing the bridge cavity is the last step before I refinish the guitar. I don't want to refin until I'm done with the major body work, because I don't want to rout on a finished guitar. I can't finish the body until I know the size of the required cavity. I can't determine the size of the cavity until I get a humbucker. I can't get a humbucker because they are unavailable from Ric. Arghh!

Any help would be appreciated. As would a used humbucker.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 12:36 pm

A high-gain pickup on a 625?
Adam, I think you should leave the wood on your 625 alone, really. I recommend you try and remove (=unglue) the magnet on the high-gain p.u. and re-install same correctly. Next, trim the magnet (its corners, that is. Use a sharp pocket knife, for instance) as necessary to make it fit into the stock cavity on your 625. This procedure will not affect the pickup output. ANYTHING to avoid molesting your 1962 625. Right, guys?

admin · Post by **admin** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 12:41 pm

Absolutely Sergio.

adam_swapp · Post by **adam_swapp** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 2:19 pm

Sergio Silva wrote: "A high-gain pickup on a 625?"

Why not? It's what Ric puts in the new ones.

Anyway, I think we're long past the point where we can avoid molesting the guitar.

When I got it, the neck cavity had been filled in, and the bridge cavity had been greatly enlarged. You can see pictures here. Considering the fact that there's now a 3-3/8" x 1-5/16" plug in the middle of the top, I'm not sure how much additional negative effect it would have to widen the cavity from 1/2" to 9/16". This isn't a pristine collector's item that we're talking about here. Nonetheless, I don't want to do anything invasive unless it's absolutely unavoidable.

In an ideal world, both cavities would be routed to original specs. This I can do. Of course, in an ideal world, a high gain and/or a humbucker would drop right in. Unfortunately, we live in an imperfect world. A high gain won't drop in to the stock cavity. Some may, but this one won't. There is a reasonable chance that a humbucker won't drop in, either. If I had a humbucker, I'd know for sure.

I had thought about just sanding/trimming the magnet as it sits. In order to get the proper fit and position, I'd have to take off a couple of "wedges" that are about 3/32" wide and taper to the midpoint of the magnet. Between realigning the flats and rounding the corners, it would take away about about 9-10% of the magnet.

I would certainly be willing to unglue and reposition the magnet, provided it could be done without harm to the pickup. What kind of glue do they use? It sounds a little dicey to use heat to soften it, as I don't want to melt the insulation on the windings. Likewise, solvents don't appeal. If you've got any suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:01 pm

I meant 'a high-gain p.u. on a 1962 625?'. Obviously the stock pickup magnet cavity on that baby is not meant for a high-gain magnet, but rather for the six magnetic slugs on a toaster pickup.
Forget about dealing with the glue that holds the magnet to the bottom of the pickup - simply use a knife to separate the magnet therefrom, period. Start at either end thereof, inserting knife between the magnet and the underside of the pickup.

jturner97 · Post by **jturner97** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 1:19 pm

im a little late, but thanks for the higain measurements doctorwho. i hadnt realized they were that high, it will help me in my search tremendously!