Treble pu capacitor

johnashfield · Post by **johnashfield** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 12:33 pm

I recently played some 4003's and the 2 'c' series basses at a shop through the same amp.

The 'c' series had a more classic sound, while the 4003's had a much darker tone.

I know some of this is due to the toaster style neck pu, but how much of this lack of clank has to do with the 'c' series maybe having the .0047 cap on the treble pu?

In fact, does the 'c' have the .0047 cap on it?

Does anyone on the board have a 4003 with the cap mod?

johnashfield · Post by **johnashfield** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 12:42 pm

I was going to have this one installed.

Is this the right cap to get?

http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?cookie%5Ftest=1&catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F011%5F002%5F004%5F003&product%5Fid=272%2D130

mortivan · Post by **mortivan** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 12:45 pm

Some purists dislike the standard ceramic cap's and recommend a more "audiophile" cap, but those .0047uF Radio Shack ones will work.

johnashfield · Post by **johnashfield** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:18 pm

I guess the question is, would adding the cap make the 4003 clank?

ojobob2 · Post by **ojobob2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:21 pm

Not really, it would just pull all the bass and mid out of your pickup - the pickups are hotter and louder/bassier than a 4001 - you need a 4001 really

rickcrazy · Post by **rickcrazy** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:23 pm

Yeah, definitely.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:24 pm

How can you tell if a Ric bass has the bass cut capaciter?

flip the toggle switch to the bridge pickup and see if you have any bass response ... if the capaciter is there then you will have no bass or low mid response from that pickup at all ...

As far as I know there is no capaciter in the c series basses ... as far as I know Ric stoped using the capaciter like 25 years ago ...

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:32 pm

I NEVER use the capaciter ... if I want more treble bite I turn up the treble ... with a sans amp, a Line 6 POD, several ampeg bass amps, and more modern technology ... I feel no need to resort to obsolete 50's technology to get treble out of my Ric ...

But what the heck ... it's your bass do what you want to it ...

I always thought that the best use of the .0047 capaciter would be if it were wired into a tone pot so you could dial in the amount of bass cut ... it would become the oposite of a tone control which is just a treble cut capaciter wired into a pot so you can dial in the amount of treble cut

ojobob2 · Post by **ojobob2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:41 pm

Jeff's right on - I play with a pick and use Stainless steel strings too.....the cap will more or less cripple your bass unless its an old 4001 - in which case it kinda has its own tone going on.

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 1:41 pm

The problem is with the capaciter I end up with a scooped out sound ... no mid punch ... the modern Rics give me that mid punch ... this is important for playing out ...

High mids and low mids are very important to an effective bass sound ...

so whether you use the capaciter or not you need to use the graphic eq properly ...

I go to a lot of open jams ... they use the same amp for everybody ... when I play I re-adjust the EQ ... any player who plays after me sounds better ... most bass players and guitarists don't know how to set the eq right ...

it is not what sounds good in your house ... it is what sounds good when you play out ... you have to boost and cut the proper frequencies to sound good

johnashfield · Post by **johnashfield** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 3:36 pm

Thanks for the responses.

My 4003 is coming with the toaster PU and I am going to have my luthier put on a c or v style pickguard.

I guess I'll just have to wait till I can get a horseshoe pu to get closer to the c sound?

Of course I may discover the 4003 sounds fine the way it is.

I must admit, in comparing the basses, the c series sounded better to my ears.

The thing is, the only difference is the pu's right? Binding or different inlays wouldn't change the tone that much.

Or would it?

jwr2 · Post by **jwr2** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:42 pm

maybe you should buy the C series ...

rictified · Post by **rictified** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 4:50 pm

I took out all my 79 4001's electronics, including pickups and out and put them in an 81 4003 until I get the proper pickups for it, it sounds almost identical to the 79. Of course it's the same wood, binding and inlays too. but the truss rod system is different. I have some Seymore Duncan pickups in the 79 now until the originals go back in, it sounds very different than it did with the Ric pickups. Ric pickups are much better sounding.
I think different wood would make a different sound but I don't think binding would make much of a difference. Inlays, possible, but I don't think much there either.

henry5 · Post by **henry5** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 2:22 am

The best way of judging difference or similarities between the sound of 2 basses is to do an acoustic comparison. Just play them both unplugged; whatever they sound like unplugged should give you a good idea of what the basses actually sound like without the differences in electrics (pickups etc) getting in the way. Every Rick I've owned has sounded different acoustically, and this has been reflected in the amplified sound. If they sound different acoustically, its unlikely they'll sound the same amplified whatever you put in them, although it will have some effect.

ilan · Post by **ilan** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 4:05 am

The cap is the single worst idea in bass design history IMHO. I would like to meet the person who came up with this brilliant idea and ask him/her a couple of questions.

13 years ago I bought a lovely 1973 4001JG, and of course had no idea about the cap. I took it to a blues gig, very proud of my new bass. During sound-check I could not get enough bottom, no matter what I tried. I had to ask a local bass player to bring his Fender. I felt humiliated. Naturally I assumed that the treble pickup was to blame. I found another treble pickup from another 73 Ric. Still no bottom. I ordered a new treble pickup from Rickenbacker. That didn't help either. Finally I sold the bass and didn't want to look at Rickenbackers again. I was so mad.

Then, more than 10 years later, I read about the cap for the first time.

So this is what the cap cost me. Two pickups, one big moment of humiliation and frustration, and 13 years without a Ric. I'm sure I'm not the only one who gave up playing Rics because of the cap. I still don't get it.

With 6-string basses like the Dano or the Fender VI, I understand the bass choke. But they have a switch.