Zero fret

[aceonbass]

The only downside to a zero fret might be wear due to string bending with roundwound strings that might lower action over time and cause fret buzz on the next fret.

[ilan]

I have always thought that the zero fret was an interesting idea as it essentially makes every note a fretted one. Is there a downside to the zero fret?

I like to use the different sound of open strings as opposed to fretted notes. Guitar players utilize that, slap bass is another example of the power of open strings. But I have never played a C64S or A/B'ed one with a non-S C64, so I don't know if I could hear the difference.

[antipodean]

I have always thought that the zero fret was an interesting idea as it essentially makes every note a fretted one. Is there a downside to the zero fret?

I concur with Dane that you may end up wearing the zero fret down prematurely, as much by the fact that it is always being fretted as by the bending. Excessive wear would not only impact on action but would also have an effect on intonation. However, my two Mosrites show reasonable wear at the zero, but both remain playable and neither has a problem with intonation (one is a '65, the other a '73, so the wear is long-term). Of course, the answer would be to replace the fret if the wear became unbearable.

[rickaddict]

I concur with Dane that you may end up wearing the zero fret down prematurely, as much by the fact that it is always being fretted as by the bending. Excessive wear would not only impact on action but would also have an effect on intonation. However, my two Mosrites show reasonable wear at the zero, but both remain playable and neither has a problem with intonation (one is a '65, the other a '73, so the wear is long-term). Of course, the answer would be to replace the fret if the wear became unbearable.

How much distance is there on your Mosrites between the nut and the zero fret? That has to factor into the wear equation. With the strings I use, the way I play, and the short distance between the nut and the zero fret, there's just not much possibility of movement on mine: http://rickresource.com/register/user_i ... llsize.jpg

I could be wrong...Ask me again in 30 years... ... but I don't think my strings have much of a chance to wear my zero fret.

[rickaddict]

In the interest of accuracy, I don't get why the C64S has a horseshoe in it. Paul's had lost it's magnetism, couldn't be recharged, and was replaced by the current bridge high gain from whatever year RIC fixed his bass. Not putting horseshoes in this bass sure woulda' freed up a few for the boutique.

The C64S is supposed to be Paul's bass as it exists today, and from what I understand the bass is currently fitted with a RI horseshoe (see pic below). I would prefer the bass as it existed in the 70's with a 70's hi-gain, (and Paul's back probably would as well) but it is what it is.

[rickaddict]

So can we conclude from this that the "S" designation on the 4001C64 model stands for "satin" + zero fret + all the features that Evan mentioned?

It is my understanding that the S does stand for "Sanded" in this case. And that seems to refer more to the body shape than the finish as the few Jetglo C64S's that I've seen were definitely glossy.

[aceonbass]

I'd be curious to know if , on the C64S, RIC made the fingerboard a bit longer at the top, or moved the tailpiece back a bit to accommodate the extra length required for the zero fret. Anyone with a C64S and a V63 wanna to a fretboard to fretboard comparison?

[rickaddict]

I'd be curious to know if , on the C64S, RIC made the fingerboard a bit longer at the top, or moved the tailpiece back a bit to accommodate the extra length required for the zero fret. Anyone with a C64S and a V63 wanna to a fretboard to fretboard comparison?

I can when I get home, but I'm pretty sure the fret board is a bit longer.

Consider exhibit A (submitted to the Register by a user in Ohio):

http://rickresource.com/register/user_i ... llsize.jpg

It's kinda hard to see because we're only talking about 2 or 3 mm here, but look at where the letters on the TRC line up with the tuners. On the C64 the second "c" in Rickenbacker seems dead even with the center of the post on the G tuner. On the C64S, it seems to be 2 or 3 mm past the center of the post which would indicate to me that the fretboard is longer and the nut/TRC were pushed 2 or 3 mm farther out.

[grazioso]

brilliant i wish they all had it including 12 And 6 string.

[rickaddict]

I like mine. The neck on my C64S is definitely larger than my 70's/80's Rick bass necks, but the frets, board and action are so perfect on my C64S (partially thanks to that zero fret) that it really makes that bass one of my favorites to play. And the tone is damn good too.

[ken_j]

I read that the zero fret on PM's bass was attached to a small piece of wood that extended the fingerboard slightly. The mod on his bass is supposedly totally reversible just by removing the extension/fret combo and placing the nut back in it's original place. A zero fret should be located exactly where the nut would normally be so the nut must be shifted up or the intonation will be off.

I have seen a close-up picture of PM's zero nut though I can't seem to remember where. It is exactly as Ted describes.

[libratune]

Here is a possibly more informative comparison a 4001C64 to a 4001C64S as respects distance between nut-to-first fret v. zero fret-to-first fret:

C64S zero fret to C64

The distance between the edge of the nut to the beginning of the first fret on the C64 is 1.805" and the same measurement on the C64S is 1.950" for a difference of 0.145". The distance between the "crown" of the zero fret (string contact made) and the beginning of the first fret on the C64S is 1.825".

I used a non-digital micrometer so these measurements are not as absolutely precise as they could be. Also, things get a bit fuzzy on the C64S when trying to go from the beginning of the first fret to the beginning of the zero fret [1.795"] and then to its crown [1.825"]. It is perhaps best to take the midpoint of these -- 1.810" -- which is pretty darn close to the 1.805" for the C64 nut-to-first fret measurement.)

[rickaddict]

And there you have it! Thanks, Ron!

[admin]

Thanks Ron. A nice comparison to be sure.

[antipodean]

How much distance is there on your Mosrites between the nut and the zero fret? That has to factor into the wear equation. With the strings I use, the way I play, and the short distance between the nut and the zero fret, there's just not much possibility of movement on mine: http://rickresource.com/register/user_i ... llsize.jpg

I could be wrong...Ask me again in 30 years... ... but I don't think my strings have much of a chance to wear my zero fret.

Hi Jeff,

The distance between the string guide and zero fret is about 4mm on my Ventures guitar and 6mm on my Mark 1 bass. There was wear on the zero fret when I got them - I believe from constantly being "fretted". The grooves wouldn't be an issue on a normal guitar, but with the tiny frets on a Mosrite, they are quite noticeable. I believe there may be only another 20 years of wear left in them...