How about the nut check ,did you do that?
After that I can give you some advice ...this is all preliminary info.
WANTED
Moderator: jingle_jangle
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Josh
Ok, here's what I have so far:
I did the nut test with the high E string. There's barely any space between the string and the fret if any. It's extremely hard to tell. The other strings all have that space.
The neck is straigt as an arrow.
The G, B & E strings all have intonation issues. For example, I'll play a C note on the A string and an octave C note on the G string. They sound fine. When I move them both up to D, the G string sounds sharp.
An open A chord is a nightmare.
Basically, the high strings are the trouble makers.
Back to you Mark.
I did the nut test with the high E string. There's barely any space between the string and the fret if any. It's extremely hard to tell. The other strings all have that space.
The neck is straigt as an arrow.
The G, B & E strings all have intonation issues. For example, I'll play a C note on the A string and an octave C note on the G string. They sound fine. When I move them both up to D, the G string sounds sharp.
An open A chord is a nightmare.
Basically, the high strings are the trouble makers.
Back to you Mark.
You need to smooth out the slots tha are pinging.
I will assume you have little in the way of tools.
So do you have feeler gages for working on cars?
If so we are in luck and then you will need some sand paper.A sheet of 360 or 220 will work .An auto motive paint supplier is good for this .You should be able to buy a single sheet.Or a really great hardware store.
The feeler gauge is only the vehicle to wrap the sandpaper around and you need to use something thinner than .016
The string could be used but it is easy to ruin the slot and the string.
I will assume you have little in the way of tools.
So do you have feeler gages for working on cars?
If so we are in luck and then you will need some sand paper.A sheet of 360 or 220 will work .An auto motive paint supplier is good for this .You should be able to buy a single sheet.Or a really great hardware store.
The feeler gauge is only the vehicle to wrap the sandpaper around and you need to use something thinner than .016
The string could be used but it is easy to ruin the slot and the string.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
The trouble the tech is having is multiple.
If you are using Pyramid strings ,they have a light core and are easily over flexed .
The neck and the middle pickups need to be unscrewed from the top and taped to the guard .The magnets are pulling on the strings and NOT giving a true reading on the strobe.
Because the guitar is new ,i will assume that the fret work is okay.Are they standard 'vintage' frets? That would be the narrow wire that is about .085 wide.The modern frets (sometimes called jumbo are about .100 to .115 wide.)are the same in height though.I assume they are crowned and not dented/worn.
If you are using Pyramid strings ,they have a light core and are easily over flexed .
The neck and the middle pickups need to be unscrewed from the top and taped to the guard .The magnets are pulling on the strings and NOT giving a true reading on the strobe.
Because the guitar is new ,i will assume that the fret work is okay.Are they standard 'vintage' frets? That would be the narrow wire that is about .085 wide.The modern frets (sometimes called jumbo are about .100 to .115 wide.)are the same in height though.I assume they are crowned and not dented/worn.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
I'm sure the techs frustration level is rising as he would rather deal with a Strat .So give the guy a break and lets look at this from his point of view.
If you tape the pickups off to the guard that will help him.
Ask him to strobe it once more with the same gauge of Ernie Balls...PLEASE!
Next shop trick...With a Q-tip or some other aplicator,Wipe some WD-40 along the edge of the saddles to lube them up.DON'T spray the bridge ...you'll have a huge mess to clean up.
This will allow the saddles to move more freely.WD-40 is a great aluminum lube,ask any machinist.
If you tape the pickups off to the guard that will help him.
Ask him to strobe it once more with the same gauge of Ernie Balls...PLEASE!
Next shop trick...With a Q-tip or some other aplicator,Wipe some WD-40 along the edge of the saddles to lube them up.DON'T spray the bridge ...you'll have a huge mess to clean up.
This will allow the saddles to move more freely.WD-40 is a great aluminum lube,ask any machinist.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
He will also need to turn off the tone control to narrow the view that the tuner sees.And he should lower the bridge pickup as far as he can .Again ...less magnet pull on the strings.
I know that you are frustrated ...but you want help and the poor guy needs to feel like you do trust him.And you need to have him do the best that can be done .
Ask the counter guys/staff if he is a beer drinker and find out what he likes to drink.A 6 pack of great ale or beer is always good to get things on your side.Tell him that you know it is a had one to intionate and you know he can do it .
Boost his confindence.
Once that is done and all these tricks performed ...check it out together.If there is still trouble ,have him email me .
I know that you are frustrated ...but you want help and the poor guy needs to feel like you do trust him.And you need to have him do the best that can be done .
Ask the counter guys/staff if he is a beer drinker and find out what he likes to drink.A 6 pack of great ale or beer is always good to get things on your side.Tell him that you know it is a had one to intionate and you know he can do it .
Boost his confindence.
Once that is done and all these tricks performed ...check it out together.If there is still trouble ,have him email me .
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
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Josh
Mark,
First off, I want to thank you for all of the help you've given me. Thanks also to Matt Bassett.
Would it be OK if I tried the intonation procedure myself? There are a couple of reasons why I ask this. First off, I really want to learn how to do this myself. It will give me a better understanding of my guitars and how they work. I'm a fairly quick study and your video is on the way. I'm also in no rush to get this done since I have another guitar. I know it won't be easy, but I'm really interested in learning how to do this.
Second, I'm fairly broke. I can't really afford another $35 set-up fee if I can't get any guarantees that this will work.
Let me know what you think. Then we'll go from there.
By the way, is it OK to use a Conn Strobe tuner instead of a Peterson?
Thanks,
Josh
First off, I want to thank you for all of the help you've given me. Thanks also to Matt Bassett.
Would it be OK if I tried the intonation procedure myself? There are a couple of reasons why I ask this. First off, I really want to learn how to do this myself. It will give me a better understanding of my guitars and how they work. I'm a fairly quick study and your video is on the way. I'm also in no rush to get this done since I have another guitar. I know it won't be easy, but I'm really interested in learning how to do this.
Second, I'm fairly broke. I can't really afford another $35 set-up fee if I can't get any guarantees that this will work.
Let me know what you think. Then we'll go from there.
By the way, is it OK to use a Conn Strobe tuner instead of a Peterson?
Thanks,
Josh
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Josh
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Josh
Hey Mark,
I have a few questions before I get started on intonating my 325.
I was fiddling with my Conn Strobotuner and I realized that it's very tough to get a read from the low E and A strings. One wheel goes one way, and the other wheel goes the other way.
This happens when I play the harmonic note. The reading is a little fuzzy.
I know when people use this tuner to tune pianos, they adjust the "cents" knob to componsate at different octaves. Is it the same for guitars?
Also, in the above posts you suggested I intonate using Ernie Ball strings. Why? I'd rather string my guitar with flats. Which brand do you recommend? Pyramids?
Thanks,
Josh
I have a few questions before I get started on intonating my 325.
I was fiddling with my Conn Strobotuner and I realized that it's very tough to get a read from the low E and A strings. One wheel goes one way, and the other wheel goes the other way.
This happens when I play the harmonic note. The reading is a little fuzzy.
I know when people use this tuner to tune pianos, they adjust the "cents" knob to componsate at different octaves. Is it the same for guitars?
Also, in the above posts you suggested I intonate using Ernie Ball strings. Why? I'd rather string my guitar with flats. Which brand do you recommend? Pyramids?
Thanks,
Josh
The Conn strobe was the industry standard for about 20 years .It was also not easy to find and hard to read .Plus you had to re calibrate it every time you moved it.They work fine ,but you should know that they are now owned by the Peterson Strobe company and out of production.When the parts run out...they are gone.
They wheels going two directions is the pull of the magnets.This is really common on Fenders and all of their clones.
On Fenders ,you have the ease of being able to drop the pickups to get the magnets away from the string -clearing the picture.This is the same when using the non strobe type tuners.ALL react to the magnets the same way.
They wheels going two directions is the pull of the magnets.This is really common on Fenders and all of their clones.
On Fenders ,you have the ease of being able to drop the pickups to get the magnets away from the string -clearing the picture.This is the same when using the non strobe type tuners.ALL react to the magnets the same way.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
To clean up your view,remove the middle and neck pickups and let them dangle on the guard while strobing.Put a piece of tape across them to keep them from clanging around.
Few repair peole do this ...it is one of the reasons for poor tuning.They think it unecessary and a hassle.What a bunch of whinners.
The next trick is to turn the tone controls off.This limits the signal and clears the view even more.
I suggested Ernie strings as they are consistant and readily available.
I will not knock anyones string ,but if you must use the Pyramids,then beware of inconsistancies from pack to pack.I like their sound and feel ...but have found this to be a rare problem.
I have this with ALL string makers ...but more so with the Pyramids.And I am sorry to say this.
Both GHS and D'addario make excellant flats,half rounds and compression wound string.But they do not package in the set/gauge like Pyramid.
Few repair peole do this ...it is one of the reasons for poor tuning.They think it unecessary and a hassle.What a bunch of whinners.
The next trick is to turn the tone controls off.This limits the signal and clears the view even more.
I suggested Ernie strings as they are consistant and readily available.
I will not knock anyones string ,but if you must use the Pyramids,then beware of inconsistancies from pack to pack.I like their sound and feel ...but have found this to be a rare problem.
I have this with ALL string makers ...but more so with the Pyramids.And I am sorry to say this.
Both GHS and D'addario make excellant flats,half rounds and compression wound string.But they do not package in the set/gauge like Pyramid.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
For intonating ,the octave needs to be about 0ne cent flat.
You picking technique and fretting must be consistant.Meaning typical of your playing style .If you are a hammerhead/basher with little finesse...sorry.
If you have a reasonable touch this will all work for you.
When you play the harmonic ,that same touch should be used when fretting.Because of the short scale ,lighter is better.
The picked string will spin sharp and then stabilize and then fall off.Try to get the wheel to barely spin sharp,that is when you are on the note.
Don't try to press the strings down to the fretboard,just the fret .
If you have a VICE grip fretting hand ,I can't help you.
So good luck ,let me know if this has helped you out.
You picking technique and fretting must be consistant.Meaning typical of your playing style .If you are a hammerhead/basher with little finesse...sorry.
If you have a reasonable touch this will all work for you.
When you play the harmonic ,that same touch should be used when fretting.Because of the short scale ,lighter is better.
The picked string will spin sharp and then stabilize and then fall off.Try to get the wheel to barely spin sharp,that is when you are on the note.
Don't try to press the strings down to the fretboard,just the fret .
If you have a VICE grip fretting hand ,I can't help you.
So good luck ,let me know if this has helped you out.
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!
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Josh
A thousand "Thank You's" Mark.
All of the information you've given me has been extremely helpful and interesting.
I'm almost positive that my tech didn't remove the neck and middle pickups, so I'm sure that this is part of the problem.
I think I'm going to change strings. I didn't have this problem with the Rickenbacker strings.
Sorry Pyramid lovers
Josh
All of the information you've given me has been extremely helpful and interesting.
I'm almost positive that my tech didn't remove the neck and middle pickups, so I'm sure that this is part of the problem.
I think I'm going to change strings. I didn't have this problem with the Rickenbacker strings.
Sorry Pyramid lovers
Josh
Try intonating WITH the Pyramids,then try changiing one of the strings ...say the low E string.Get a couple of other brand singles ...try that .See if there is a difference.
Keep us posted.
Ricks are not 'Easy' to work on ,like Fenders are ,and as the world is flooded with Fenders and their clones ,this seems to be a problem.
When i left Rick in Oct 1976 ,I discovered that no one in the Sanfrancisco area really wanted to work on them.I got lots of business.But at the same time no one wanted to work on Gretschs' either nor Gibson ES-335 guitars .
I took that as ..."I want to work on these." and have done well by it .It is a mind set .It must be gotten over.
Too many repair peoples are hooked on ,"if I can't do this without taking it apart and re-assembling it ...I don't really want to do it ."
Keep us posted.
Ricks are not 'Easy' to work on ,like Fenders are ,and as the world is flooded with Fenders and their clones ,this seems to be a problem.
When i left Rick in Oct 1976 ,I discovered that no one in the Sanfrancisco area really wanted to work on them.I got lots of business.But at the same time no one wanted to work on Gretschs' either nor Gibson ES-335 guitars .
I took that as ..."I want to work on these." and have done well by it .It is a mind set .It must be gotten over.
Too many repair peoples are hooked on ,"if I can't do this without taking it apart and re-assembling it ...I don't really want to do it ."
So you too want yours "ALAPWOB"?!?!